[00:00:05]
          A LITTLE BIT LATE. I HAVE TO CHEW. THAT'S FINE. I'M CALLING THIS SPECIAL COMMISSION MEETING OF THE STUART CITY COMMISSION BUDGET WORKSHOP NUMBER ONE FOR THE 11TH OF AUGUST, 2025. TO 
          [ROLL CALL]
ORDER. ROLL CALL PLEASE. MAYOR RICH HERE, VICE MAYOR COLLINS HERE. COMMISSIONER CLARK HERE. 
          COMMISSIONER. JOB HERE. COMMISSIONER REID HERE. PLEASE STAND FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG. UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS. ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. 
          THANK ALL OF YOU WHO AREN'T CITY STAFF WHO MADE THE EFFORT TO COME OUT AND ATTEND AS A EARLY 
          [1. BUDGET PRESENTATION]
IN THE AFTERNOON MEETING. MR. MARTELL, DO YOU WANT TO START THIS OFF OR SHOULD WE JUST GO? I WANT TO SAY, OBVIOUSLY, TODAY IS THE BUDGET PRESENTATION. THE FINANCE DIRECTOR AND I HAVE BEEN TRYING TO PUT THE BUDGET TOGETHER, AND JULIE'S GOING TO GO THROUGH IT WITH YOU SHORTLY. 
          SINCE OUR LAST MEETING WHEN YOU WERE PROVIDED THE BUDGET PREVIEW, WE'VE HAD INDIVIDUAL MEETINGS WITH ALL OF THE DIRECTORS OF ALL OF THE DEPARTMENTS MADE VARIOUS CUTS AND THE DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS, AND ALSO EVALUATED THE CITY OF STUART IN COMPARISON TO OTHER CITIES OF OUR SIZE BY POPULATION, OUR SIZE BY BUDGET, OUR SIZE AND LOCATION, OUR SIZE BY EMPLOYEES, OUR SIZE BY SERVICES AND OTHER THINGS. I'VE ALSO HEARD LOTS OF COMMENTS FROM MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC AND OTHERS THAT HAVE ASKED QUESTIONS. AND I, I WANT TO GIVE AN EXAMPLE. 
          NOT THAT I'M CALLING OUT ANY CITIES, BUT I'M GOING TO USE NAPLES, FOR EXAMPLE, BECAUSE SOMEBODY SAID TO ME, WELL, WHY ISN'T THE CITY OF STUART LIKE NAPLES? THEIR MILLAGE RATE IS ONLY 2.7 MILLS AND NAPLES MILLAGE RATE IS ONLY 2.7 MILLS. BUT IT GENERA THEIR ASSESSED VALUE OF THEIR CITY I THINK IS $18 BILLION AND OURS IS $3 BILLION. AND IN ADDITION TO THAT, NAPLES PAYS AN ADDITIONAL 2.4 MILLS FOR THEIR FIRE DEPARTMENT AND OTHERS. SO WHEN YOU LOOK ONLINE AND JUST SAY, WHAT'S THE CITY OF STUARTS MILLAGE RATE VERSUS WHATEVER OTHER CITY IT IS OUT THERE, SOMETIMES YOU NEED TO LOOK A LITTLE DEEPER BECAUSE, FOR EXAMPLE, NAPLES MIGHT GIVE YOU THE REFLECTION THAT THEIRS IS HALF OF WHAT OURS IS, BUT IT REALLY GENERATES ABOUT $57 MILLION, WHEREAS OURS GENERATES ABOUT 17 OR $18 MILLION. AND IT DOESN'T PAY FOR THEIR FIRE BECAUSE THEY HAVE AN ADDITIONAL 2.4 MILLS ON TOP OF THAT, 2.7 MILLS THAT THEY PAY FOR JUST FOR THEIR FIRE ASSESSMENT. AND I SAY THAT FOR CLARIFICATION FOR ANYBODY THAT'S GONE THROUGH AND TRIED TO COMPARE US TO THE CITY LIST. BUT WITH THAT, I WILL LET OUR FINANCE DIRECTOR, JOE LEE, START THE PRESENTATION. AND OBVIOUSLY, IF COMMISSIONERS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, WE'LL ANSWER THOSE ALONG THE WAY OR AT THE END. AND THEN WHEN HE'S FINISHED, I'LL HAVE A COUPLE COMMENTS AND WE'LL GO FROM THERE. JOE LEE, YOU WANT TO TAKE IT FROM HERE? YES. WELL GOOD AFTERNOON. AND FIRST OFF AND FOREMOST, RIGHT IN THE TIME THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PERFORMANCE, I DIDN'T GET IT DONE TODAY. I TRIED TO CALL THE CITY MANAGER A FEW MINUTES AGO. THESE NUMBERS ARE LITERALLY STILL COMING TO ME. LIKE, YOU KNOW, TEN MINUTES AGO, WE'RE CRUNCHING NUMBERS, DOING THINGS LIKE THAT. SO I DON'T HAVE A NICE, PRETTY POWERPOINT FOR YOU TODAY, BUT WE WILL PRODUCE A TOTAL PDF FOR THE CLERK TO GO INTO THE PUBLIC RECORD AND ALL THAT. SO ACTUALLY WE'RE GOING TO BE LOOKING AT SOME OF JUST THE RAW REPORTS, SOME OF THE QUESTIONS THAT CAME TO ME FROM THE COMMISSIONERS REQUIRED SOME DATA CALCULATIONS. 
          AND WE'LL BE WE'LL BE GOING THROUGH THAT. SO YEAH, RIGHT NOW I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU IT'S GOING TO BE A DIFFERENT LOOK THAN USUAL. WE'RE GOING TO GO DIRECTLY INTO THE PRODUCT SOME OF THE TIMES. IT'S GOING TO BE THERE. AND. I'M GOING TO HELP YOU WALK THROUGH IT. I PREPARED SEVERAL REPORTS FOR YOU. LET ME MUTE THAT. SO LET'S SEE I APOLOGIZE. WE'RE STILL LAUNCHING SOME OF THE REPORTS BECAUSE I HAD TO MOVE FROM MY OFFICE OVER TO HERE. WHILE HE'S PULLING IT UP, I WILL SAY THAT BASED UPON THE LAST MEETING, THE COMMISSION. DISCUSSED THE NOT TO EXCEED MILLAGE RATE AND THE NOT TO EXCEED MILLAGE RATE WAS FIVE MILLS. AND THERE WAS ALSO A DISCUSSION ABOUT REDUCING OR HAVING A NOT TO EXCEED RATE OF 4.75 MILLS. SO AS THE FINANCE DIRECTOR AND I WERE GOING THROUGH THE BUDGET, EVERYTHING WAS DONE KIND OF AS A DUAL 
          [00:05:06]
REVIEW. AND SO WHEN WE PRESENT THE NUMBERS TO YOU TODAY, IT'S NOT GOING WE'RE NOT WE DON'T HAVE A BALANCED BUDGET TODAY ANYWAY. I THINK WE'RE OFF BY A COUPLE HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS IF IT'S FIVE MILLS AND OFF OF ABOUT $800,000 IF IT'S 4.75. BUT THERE'S OTHER PLACES THAT FUNDS CAN BE REDIRECTED. AND THAT'S KIND OF A POLICY DECISION. AND THEN I'LL BE LOOKING FOR YOU GUYS AS WE GET TOWARD THE END AS TO WHAT DIRECTION YOU WANT TO GO. BUT WE KIND OF HAVE PUT THAT INTO A FAIRLY STRAIGHTFORWARD PRESENTATION WHEN WE GET THERE. LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU'RE READY TO, BUT WE'LL START WITH IT. HE'S OBVIOUSLY TRYING TO PULL IT UP, BUT WHAT WE DID IS WE, YOU KNOW, TOOK ALL THE REVENUES, WENT THROUGH IT, TRIED TO DO THE ESTIMATES. WE DETERMINED STATE REVENUES, WHETHER IT WAS FRANCHISE FEES, WHETHER IT WAS REVENUES FROM OUR PROPERTY MANAGEMENT FUND, WHETHER IT WAS AD VALOREM. AND THEN WE WENT AGAINST OUR EXPENSES. AND WHEN I TALK ABOUT MAKING ADJUSTMENTS FROM EXPENSES, LIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, ONE OF THE THINGS IS WE HAD A NUMBER OF MONEY, A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT WAS SET FOR RESERVES AND FOR A PARTICULAR BUDGET ITEM. AND I SAID, WELL, INSTEAD OF $250,000 GOING TO THAT RESERVE, LET'S CUT THAT IN HALF AND ONLY PAY $125,000 TO THAT RESERVE. SO MOVING FORWARD, I COULD REDUCE THAT TO ZERO. BUT OBVIOUSLY I DON'T WANT TO LEAVE A RESERVE AT ZERO BECAUSE IF SOMETHING BREAKS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, ZERO TURNS OUT TO BE A DISASTER. BUT I COULD LOWER IT FROM 125 TO $50,000 AND PICK UP $75,000 ON THAT END. AND SO THERE'S SOME DISCUSSIONS LIKE THAT, THAT WHEN I GET THE DIRECTION AND POLICY FROM YOU GUYS TODAY, WE CAN GO BACK BETWEEN NOW AND THE NEXT BUDGET MEETING AND FINALIZE THOSE THINGS AND TIGHTEN THAT DOWN. THE INTENTION ISN'T FOR YOU GUYS TO HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT HOW MANY PENCILS ARE GOING TO BE IN A PARTICULAR DEPARTMENT, AS MUCH AS IT'S GOING TO BE REALLY TO SET THE POLICY AND THE DIRECTIONS OF WHAT YOU WANT ON THE ACTUAL BUDGET, I ALSO DETERMINED THAT THE CONSENSUS IS THAT THE STUART EMPLOYEES IN THE TREASURE COAST, IT'S UNDISPUTED AND WELL KNOWN THAT OVERALL, STUART EMPLOYEES STARTING RATES ARE LESS THAN AND MAYBE SOME ARE EQUAL TO, BUT NONE ARE GREATER THAN MARTIN COUNTY. SAINT LUCIE COUNTY, PORT SAINT LUCIE, FORT PIERCE, PALM BEACH COUNTY, PALM BEACH GARDENS, JUPITER AND THE SURROUNDING COMMUNITIES. NOT THAT THEY'RE SIGNIFICANTLY DIFFERENT, BUT IT'S A FAIRLY COMMON DISCUSSION BECAUSE I. I HAVE LOTS OF EMPLOYEES THAT MENTION THAT TO ME. BUT AGAIN, THERE'S PUTS AND TAKES AS IT RELATES TO THINGS LIKE THAT. AND THE BALANCES ARE THAT STUART'S ALSO A PRETTY GOOD PLACE TO WORK. AND THERE'S, YOU KNOW, OTHER THINGS LIKE IN PALM BEACH COUNTY, THE BUILDINGS ARE 25 STORIES TALL. AND THERE'S THE TRAFFIC AND THE CRIME RATES AND THINGS LIKE THAT ARE SIGNIFICANTLY DIFFERENT. SO THERE'S LOTS OF GIVES AND TAKES AS IT RELATES TO THOSE. THE OTHER THING IS WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT LEVELS OF SERVICE IN THE COUNTY, THE MARTIN COUNTY'S MILLAGE RATE, I BELIEVE, IS GOING TO COME OUT AT LIKE 6.6 MILLS. BUT IF YOU'RE A COUNTY RESIDENT, YOU ALSO THEN PAY ON TOP OF THAT, 6.6 MILLS, 2.67 MILLS FOR FIRE. AND THEN YOU ALSO PAY A STORMWATER MILLAGE RATE AND YOU PAY A STREETS MILLAGE RATE, AND YOU PAY A PARKS AND REC MILLAGE RATE, AND THERE'S SEVERAL OTHERS. SO IF YOU'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE CITY PROVIDES IN ONE BASKET AND WHAT THE COUNTY PROVIDES IN ONE BASKET ARE FIVE MILLS, PROVIDES THE FIRE AND THE PARKS AND THE ROADS AND THE STUFF, WHEREAS IN THE OTHER AREAS THERE'S OTHER ADDITIONAL EXPENSES RELATED TO IT. DID YOU WANT TO SEE THAT? NO. I'M READY. I'M READY TO GO. YEAH. OKAY. ARE YOU READY? YEAH. AS READY AS I COULD BE. OKAY. SO JUST A SUMMARY OF WHERE WE ARE TODAY, AND I'LL GET TO UPSIZE THIS FOR EVERYONE. SO HERE WE GO. AND ALL RIGHT, SO WHEN WE MET ON JULY 14TH, REVENUES WERE AT 44 MILLION. THE APPROPRIATIONS WERE AT 48 MILLION. WE WERE OUT OF BALANCE. AND THAT WAS AT FIVE MILLS, $3.9 MILLION. AND AT THAT TIME, I DON'T KNOW IF WE MADE IT CLEAR AT THAT TIME THAT THE APPROPRIATION REQUEST OF 48 522 538 WAS ONLY ABOUT $358,000 HIGHER THAN WHAT THE DEPARTMENTS HAD ASKED FOR THE PRIOR YEAR. HOWEVER, THERE WAS A FLIP BETWEEN CAPITAL AND OPERATING, 
          [00:10:03]
AND SO IN 20 FIVE'S BUDGET, THERE WAS A LARGE NUMBER ABOUT $4 MILLION WORTH OF CAPITAL IN THAT NUMBER, YOU KNOW, 3 MILLION AND CHANGE. AND SO CAPITAL ARE ITEMS THAT WHEN I TALK ABOUT THESE RABBITS TO FUND ALL THE HATS, YOU KNOW, WE HAD WE HAD SOME ARPA MONEY, WE HAD IMPACT FEES, WE HAD SOME GRANTS. THERE WERE OTHER THINGS THAT COULD BE USED TO FUND THOSE. HOWEVER, THIS YEAR THERE WAS A FLIP. SO THE DEPARTMENTS DID AN EXCELLENT JOB OF CUTTING THEIR CAPITAL REQUEST DOWN TO WHAT THEY FELT WAS REALLY NECESSARY AS FAR AS WANTS AND NEEDS, BUT THAT BECAUSE OF THE ADDITION OF SOME STAFF AND OTHER OPERATING COSTS, THE ADDITIONS IN BENEFITS AND STUFF, WE HAD A FLIP AND I CAN'T FUND PERSONAL SERVICES WITH TEAM OR WITH IMPACT FEES. I CAN'T FUND PERSONAL SERVICES WITH GRANTS I CAN'T FUND, YOU KNOW, I CAN'T FUND STAFF WITH SPECIAL ASSESSMENTS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. RIGHT. AND THEN WE ALSO HAVE THIS FUND THING WHERE EACH FUND IS ITS OWN STANDALONE ENTITY. SO LIKEWISE, EVEN THOUGH WE'VE HAD SOME CREATIVE IDEAS IN THE PAST ABOUT COMMUNITY POLICING, YOU CAN'T, YOU KNOW, FOR INSTANCE, FUND THE FIRE DEPARTMENT WITH CRA MONEY. YOU CAN'T FUND THE POLICE DEPARTMENT WITH WATER, SEWER MONEY. SO EACH FUND IS ITS OWN STANDALONE ENTITY. AND WHEN WE CAME FORWARD, TO BE HONEST, WE WERE ONLY REALLY FOCUSED ABOUT GENERAL FUND BECAUSE THE ENTERPRISE FUNDS BY BOND COVENANTS AND BY DEBT COVENANTS, THEY THEY MUST PROVIDE FOR THE WATER. THEY HAVE TO DO IT. SO WE HAVE TO FUND THE ENTERPRISE FUNDS. SO I DID REALLY HAVE A CONCERN WITH THOSE. BUT GENERAL FUND IS USUALLY THAT GETS THE SPOTLIGHT. SO THAT $3.9 MILLION. SO WHAT'S HAPPENED SINCE THEN IS WE'VE ADJUSTED REVENUES $3 MILLION UP. AND THIS APPROPRIATION ADJUSTMENT, UNFORTUNATELY IT'S INCREDIBLY LONG LIST. AND I'M GOING TO DO MY BEST TO SUMMARIZE IT FOR YOU. 
          THIS IS THE NET EFFECT OF THE PUTS AND TAKES. SO SOME OF THE THERE'S ABOUT 1,000,005 THAT THE MANAGER CUT OUT OF THE BUDGET. BUT THERE WAS ALSO ADDITIONS. SO AS WE MENTIONED IN THE LAST HEARING, WE DID NOT HAVE THE FRS RATE INCREASES IN THAT BUDGET. WE DIDN'T HAVE ALL THE UNION NEGOTIATIONS IN THAT BUDGET. WE ALSO DIDN'T HAVE THE HEALTH INSURANCE INCREASE IN THAT BUDGET. SO JUST AS A ZOOM DOWN EXAMPLE, HEALTH INSURANCE RATES WENT UP 22%. HOWEVER, TO KEEP THE RATE ON THE EMPLOYEES AT A 12% INCREASE, THIS NUMBER NOW INCLUDES A $297,000 BALLOON PAYMENT THAT THE CITY HAD TO MAKE TO, IN A SENSE, BUY DOWN THE RATE TO KEEP THE EFFECT AT 12% INSTEAD OF HITTING THE EMPLOYEES WITH 22%. SO THE CITY TOOK THE BRUNT OF THE INCREASE IN THE HEALTH INSURANCE PLAN. SO THAT'S JUST A ONE LINE EXPENSE THAT THE MANAGER HAD TO ADD. SO THE 48,000,005 22 538 THAT WE WERE SITTING ON ON JULY 14TH, WE HAD TO ADD JUST 297,000 TO THAT FOR FUN. AND JUST JUST FOR GIGGLES, WE HAD TO ADD 300,000 TO HELP BUY DOWN THE HEALTH INSURANCE INCREASE. WE ALSO HAD TO ADD IN THOSE SARS RATES AND THE REST OF THE UNION INCREASES. 
          LIKEWISE, SINCE THEN THERE'S ALWAYS A NUMBER OF CHANGES BECAUSE THE PERSONNEL BUDGET THAT WE WERE LOOKING AT AT THAT TIME WAS ALREADY SEVERAL WEEKS OLD WHEN WE HAD PROCESSED THE 3,000,009. SO PART OF THIS EXERCISE TODAY IS WE HAVE ALSO UPDATED THE PERSONNEL BUDGET, WHAT WE CALL THE WORKFORCE PLAN TO, I DON'T KNOW, SUNDAY EVENING AT 7 P.M. OR SOMETHING. SO THE NUMBERS THAT WE'RE WORKING WITH RIGHT NOW IN THE PERSONNEL BUDGET, WHICH AGAIN, IS WHY I'M CRUNCHED FOR TIME, WE TRIED TO MAKE IT AS AS RELEVANT AND CURRENT AS POSSIBLE. SO THOSE CHANGES IN PERSONNEL, ALONG WITH THE CUTS AND THE THINGS STILL NETTED OUT TO A $661,000 GAIN AGAINST THE EXPENSES. SO MILLION FIVE CUTS OUT, ADDS BACK FOR HEALTH INSURANCE PERSONNEL CHANGES, UNION FEES NETTED OUT TO 601. SO TODAY, IF WE WERE STILL AT FIVE MILLS, WE'RE LOOKING TODAY AT BEING A MILLION 261 OUT OF BALANCE RIGHT NOW. AND THE MANAGER ALLUDED TO THE FACT THAT HE HAS SOME OTHER CUTS IN HIS POCKET. WE'RE GOING TO DISCUSS THOSE IN JUST A MOMENT. 
          NOW JUST BELOW THAT IS AND I BELIEVE ONE OF THE COMMISSIONERS ASKED ME IF I COULD TELL WHAT HE WAS GETTING AT, IF I COULD SMELL WHAT HE WAS COOKING, IF I WAS PICKING UP WHAT HE WAS PUTTING DOWN. SO THIS BUDGET HAS BEEN PREPARED NOW WITH A 0.25 MILLAGE REDUCTION TO 4.75 MILLS. WHAT THAT DID WAS THAT ADDED AN ADDITIONAL $913,950 REDUCTION IN REVENUES, BUT WE DID GAIN BACK 152,304. IN THE REDUCTION OF WHAT WE PAY THE CRA. SO THAT'S ABOUT A $700,000 NET THERE. SO 
          [00:15:02]
THAT PUTS US CURRENTLY TODAY WITH THE CUTS THAT ARE IN STONE THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN PUT INTO THIS BUDGET AT 2 MILLION, 223 OUT OF BUDGET TODAY, IF WE WERE TO ADOPT AN ACTUAL 4.75 MILLS, THEN BELOW THAT YOU'LL SEE OUT TO THE SIDE. I'VE PUT TWO NUMBERS RIGHT. OH OH BE OUT OF BALANCE WITH CUTS ONE THROUGH FOUR. SO DOWN AT THE BOTTOM THESE CUTS AND I ACTUALLY SPLIT IT INTO FOUR A AND FOUR B BOSS BASED ON OUR DISCUSSION. SO WE'VE ALREADY IDENTIFIED $261,000 POSSIBLE CUTS TO THE FLEET MANAGEMENT SYSTEM. THE BASICALLY THE PASSENGER CARS AND THE FLEET VEHICLES OF THE CITY. WE HAVE WE HAVE A LEASE PROGRAM THAT HAS TIMED REPLACEMENT OF VEHICLES AND ETC, AND WE'D BE MAKING ADJUSTMENTS TO THAT PROGRAM THAT WOULD SAVE OR DEFER WHATEVER WOULD RESULT IN A $261,213 CUT TO THE BUDGET. NEXT IS THE MANAGER WAS OPENING UP WITH HIS MONOLOGUE ABOUT BEING ABLE TO DEFER SOME OF THE RESERVES OF THIS $341,161 IS A CALCULATED NUMBER BASED ON OUR SCHEDULE. WE MAINTAIN A SCHEDULE ABOUT FIVE YEARS OUT OF PROJECTS AND ALSO OUR CIP, AND THEN ALSO OF FLEET. SO THESE TWO NUMBERS NUMBER TWO AND NUMBER THREE ON PAPER, WE SHOULD PUT AWAY ABOUT $340,000 THIS YEAR FOR SOME CAPITAL PROJECTS IN THE FUTURE THAT ARE BELOW THAT, YOU KNOW, CIP, $5 MILLION OR MORE PROJECT KIND OF THING. THESE ARE SMALL PROJECTS AROUND THE CITY. AND THEN ALSO WE HAVE A CAPITAL FLEET REPLACEMENT RESERVE THAT WE FUND FOR THOSE VEHICLES THAT AREN'T PASSENGER CARS. THINGS LIKE LAWNMOWERS, TRAILERS, BACK END, YOU KNOW, BACK LOADERS, FRONT LOADERS, ANYTHING RELATED TO THOSE KIND OF VEHICLE, LARGE EQUIPMENT PURCHASES. SO ON THE CHOPPING BLOCK RIGHT NOW IS THE MANAGER SAID, OKAY, WE CAN NOT PUT THE 341,000 INTO THE RESERVE THIS YEAR. NOT CUTTING. THAT'S NOT CUTTING. A CURRENT CAPITAL PROJECT REQUESTED IN THE 26 BUDGET. IT'S CUTTING THE FUTURE FUNDING FOR PROJECTS, YOU KNOW, POSSIBLY FIVE YEARS DOWN THE ROAD. AND THEN THE 250 IS HE WOULD NOT FUND THE FULL AMOUNT THAT I HAD ASKED FOR INTO THAT FLEET REPLACEMENT FOR LAWN MOWERS AND TRAILERS AND THINGS SUCH AS THAT. SO AGAIN, NOT CUTTING CURRENT REQUEST. THIS ISN'T PART OF THE MILLION FIVE CUTS THAT WE ALREADY DID. SO THESE WOULD BE ADDITIONAL CUTS DEFERRING THAT FUNDING ON THE FLEET. AND THEN NEXT IS FOR A. SO IN THIS NUMBER THIS 300,000 IS A PORTION OF. CUTS TO PERSONNEL. THESE WOULD BE POSITION ELIMINATIONS. THESE WOULD BE POSITIONS THAT WE'VE IDENTIFIED AT THE CITY THAT COULD BE ELIMINATED, AS WELL AS SOME OPERATING AND MAINTENANCE DEFERRALS, THINGS RELATED TO SOME OF THOSE POSITIONS AND WHAT, WHAT MIGHT GO IF THOSE POSITIONS WENT. AND THEN THE I CAN CHIME IN JUST BRIEFLY ON THIS, PLEASE DO THE $1.5 MILLION IN CUTS THAT WE'VE ALREADY MADE INCLUDE BOTH PERSONNEL REDUCTION AS WELL AS OPERATION AND MAINTENANCE, REDUCTION AND DEFERRAL. SO IT THAT NUMBER ALSO INCLUDES FULL TIME, FULL TIME EMPLOYMENT POSITIONS THAT WOULD NOT BE REPLACED, THAT THE CITY WOULD SIMPLY OPERATE WITHOUT, AND OPERATION AND MAINTENANCE OF CERTAIN ASPECTS OF THE CITY THAT JUST ARE EITHER DEFERRED OR WOULD CHANGE IN THE FUTURE BASED UPON ROTATIONS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. SO THE 300 HASN'T BEEN PUT INTO IT YET, INTO THE BUDGET YET. THESE ONE THROUGH FOUR B ARE STILL KIND OF JULIE AND I ARE WORKING ON THAT NUMBER AND ADJUSTING IT. THE 1.5 THAT'S ALREADY TAKEN PLACE HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE. SO THESE BUT THAT DESCRIPTION OF BOTH PERSONNEL AND OPERATION OF THE CITY AS KIND OF A CATCH ALL. YES. THE ACTUAL BUDGET REPORTS RIGHT NOW READ 2,000,023 448. SO THAT'S WHY THE REST OF THIS ON THE EXCEL IS OUR MATH. SO IF YOU WERE TO ACCEPT THESE CUTS INTO IT, WOULD IT WOULD CHANGE THE 2023448 OKAY. AND THEN THIS FOUR B THIS EVEN IS AS LATE AS THIS MORNING IN A MEETING WITH THE CITY MANAGER, WE IDENTIFIED. WHAT NUMBER DID YOU WANT TO DISCUSS THERE? I, I DON'T REMEMBER. IT WAS JUST OTHER. WE HAVE OTHER CUTS THAT WE KNOW 
          [00:20:01]
RIGHT NOW THAT WE COULD TAKE TO GO FURTHER IN. YES, SIR. IF WE INSTITUTE THE 4.7 REDUCTION THAT 13 IT CURRENTLY SAYS 232 448 RIGHT. ISN'T THAT WHAT THE NUMBER WOULD BE? YOU SAID THAT. 
          SO THAT'S WHAT WE'RE OUT OF BALANCE. WELL LIKE YOU WOULD THE MAGIC 152 OFF OF THAT, THEN WE WOULD BE THIS, THIS 152 AT THE BOTTOM OR 1152 AT THE BOTTOM. THOSE CUTS HAVE ALREADY BEEN MADE. THEY HAVE NOT. THESE ARE THE 1,000,152 ARE ARE ON PAPER. AND WE COULD MAKE THEM RIGHT NOW WE'VE IDENTIFIED THEM AND IT WOULD REDUCE AND IT WOULD PUT US WITHIN $109,000 OF THE FIVE MILLS, AND IT WOULD PUT US ABOUT A MILLION OUT OF THE 4.75. AND TO YOUR POINT, MAYOR. YES. IF WE SUDDENLY SAID WE FOUND ANOTHER. YOU KNOW, THEN WE WOULDN'T BE OUT OF BALANCE ANYMORE. WE'D BE 700 TO THE GOOD AT FIVE MILLS, AND WE'D BE BALANCED AT 4.75 MILLS. SO THAT THAT'S. YEAH. IF WE FOUND ANOTHER 800,000, 70, 136. SO FOUR B IS SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 0 AND 871,000. YEAH. 
          RIGHT. YES. THAT'S WHY IT'S BLANK OKAY. SO NOW TO THAT POINT HOW DID HOW IS THIS HAPPENING. 
          SO. THE WAY THAT WE'VE GOTTEN THERE TO THIS POINT AND I UNDERSTAND, MAYOR, THAT YOU HAD SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT THE REVENUES. SO. FIRST OFF, THE TALLAHASSEE STILL HAS NOT RELEASED OUR CST REVENUES. THEY HAVEN'T RELEASED THE FUEL TAX REVENUES. THEY HAVEN'T RELEASED SOME OF THE OTHER ONES, AND THEY'VE UPDATED A COUPLE TWICE. SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S AS OF RIGHT NOW YOU'RE LOOKING AT THIS LIVE. SO THEY STILL HAVEN'T GIVEN US ALL THE NUMBERS. SO A LOT OF THESE ARE STILL MY REVENUE MODEL ESTIMATES. AND SO TO THAT THE WAY THAT WE GOT HERE THAT THAT CHANGE IN REVENUE. SO HERE I'M CURRENTLY REFLECTING A REDUCTION IN AD VALOREM. I'LL ZOOM IN A LITTLE MORE AGAIN FOR THE FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE SEATS. NO NOT THAT ONE. THIS ONE OKAY. SO WE ARE CURRENTLY REFLECTING THAT 913. SO THE AS I SAID A MOMENT AGO, THE BUDGET RIGHT NOW SITS AT 2,000,023 448 OUT. ASSUMING AS IF WE'D DONE THE QUARTER MILL. I DIDN'T WANT TO KEEP THAT ON EXCEL. THAT WOULD BE HARD TO KEEP TRACK OF. SO KEEPING IT IN THE BUDGET MAKES ALL THE REPORTS UPDATE. AND THEN HERE. I DID A REDUCTION IN IN BUILDING PERMIT BECAUSE THERE WERE CUTS IN IN A PARTICULAR DEPARTMENT. THIS HAD TO BE REMOVED THAT THAT WAS AN ERROR IN THE THING. I'VE LOOKED AT CONTRIBUTION FOR PRIVATE. IT WAS YOU KNOW, IT WAS OFF OFF BUDGET UTILITY TAX, NATURAL GAS. 
          NOW I UPPED THAT ONE. OUR COLLECTIONS ARE ARE ADVANCING BEYOND THE CURRENT YEAR BUDGET AND THE PROJECTIONS THAT LOOK FOR IT VOTED DEBT SERVICE MILLAGE. THIS IS SET EXACTLY TO WHAT THE TAXPAYERS VOTED FOR AS THE VOTED DEBT SERVICE MILLAGE ON THE PUBLIC SAFETY COMPLEX. SO THIS IS JUST A PLUG. SO YOU HAVE OUR ACTUAL AD VALOREM COMING IN IS IF YOU LOOK AT THIS YEAR, THE REQUESTED NUMBER, THE REQUESTED NUMBER IS WHAT IT WAS AT FIVE MILLS. THE MANAGER RECOMMENDED NUMBER IS WHAT IT'S AT AT 4.75 MILLS. YEAH. AND THE RECOMMENDED THAT JOLIE INCREASED IT FROM 19 TO 23 WAS BASED UPON CONSUMPTION. ARE ANY OF THESE SPREADSHEETS SHOWING PREVIOUS YEARS AT LEAST LAST YEAR. OH THEY TRY TO COMPARE. THEY THEY ARE WHERE THINGS HAVE CHANGED. 
          YES. THEY I MEAN, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT IN THE PRESENTATION TODAY, BUT IT'LL BE IN THE FINAL PRODUCT I GIVE YOU AFTER THIS MEETING. OKAY. WE, WE LIKE I SAID, WE'VE WERE IN THE ONE YOU GAVE US. YES. THEY WERE IN THEY WERE IN BEFORE THE REASON THAT I DON'T HAVE A POWERPOINT READY FOR YOU RIGHT NOW. THAT'S WHY WE'RE DOING IT RIGHT ON THESE SCHEDULES I COULD GET. I'M NOT GRILLING YOU. I'M JUST CURIOUS. YEAH. THE. SO WHAT WE HAVE IN THE BUDGET DOCUMENT, IN THE BUDGET SYSTEM IS 2020 FOUR'S BUDGET 2024 IS ACTUAL 2025 BUDGET YEAR TO DATE. YOU KNOW, WHATEVER REVENUE EXPENSE, WHATEVER. AND THEN YOU KNOW WHAT THE WHAT THE DEPARTMENT'S REQUESTED AND NOW WHAT THE MANAGER RECOMMENDED. SO THERE'S BASICALLY LIKE SEVEN COLUMNS IN THERE. SO THAT REPORT WOULD INCLUDE THAT FOR YOU. HOWEVER I WOULD CAUTION YOU. AND SO THE MANAGER WAS IN MY OFFICE THIS MORNING VERY EARLY, AND I WAS SHOWING HIM SO DELINQUENT AD VALOREM. HE'S LIKE, HOW DO WE HAVE DELINQUENT AD VALOREM? SO I WAS EXPLAINING, WHEN PEOPLE DON'T PAY THEIR TAX BILL AND THERE'S A LIEN WHEN THEY FINALLY CLEAR THAT LIEN AND THE MONEY 
          [00:25:03]
COMES THROUGH, WE MAY COLLECT AD VALOREM TAXES FROM LAST YEAR OR THE YEAR BEFORE OR WHATEVER. 
          WELL, THERE APPARENTLY WAS A LARGE ONE PAID. SO IT'S LIKE 291,000 IS THE YEAR TO DATE NUMBER. I'M BUDGETING 10,000 BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT IT USUALLY IS. THAT'S CLICK BAIT. I WOULDN'T SAY WE JUST FOUND $300,000 AND PUT THAT IN THERE. DO YOU UNDERSTAND. SO JUST SAYING BEING ABLE TO SEE THE ACTUAL AND WHAT WAS COLLECTED LAST YEAR. SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO KNOW THE UNDERLYING HISTORY OF THE NUMBER AND WHAT IT'S MADE UP OF, TO NOT BE LED ASTRAY BY SOMETHING THAT'S EITHER ARTIFICIALLY HIGH OR MAYBE ARTIFICIALLY LOW. AND WE ALSO RAN INTO THAT WITH ARPA FUNDS, BECAUSE LAST YEAR WAS LIKE THE LAST YEAR OF ARPA FUNDS. SO THERE'S A LOT OF MONEY THAT EXISTS THERE THAT WAS NOT RECURRING, AND THAT DOESN'T EXIST ANY LONGER. CORRECT. AND SO DOWN THE LINE, TO YOUR POINT, COMMISSIONER, EACH ONE OF THESE, I AM LOOKING AT WHAT WAS COLLECTED LAST YEAR VERSUS THIS YEAR. AND SO BUT AS TO THE VOTED DEBT MILLAGE THAT WE WERE ON, THAT IS A YOU CAN'T THAT HAS TO BE SET TO THE AMOUNT THAT THIS YEAR'S DEBT IS. SO THAT'S NOT SOMETHING I REALLY GET TO PROJECT. IT JUST HAS TO BE SET TO THAT. BUT THE VOTED DEBT DELINQUENT, I DID UP IT FROM 5000 TO 10,000, EVEN THOUGH RIGHT NOW, IF YOU LOOK AT RS $290,000 IN THERE, BECAUSE THAT'S NOT A REAL NUMBER. AND THEN ZONING FEES, WE DO SEEM TO BE GOING FORWARD ON THAT. NOW, AGAIN, GIVEN, YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S A SLOWDOWN IN IN DEVELOPMENT PROCESS, I WOULD EXPECT THAT PEOPLE WOULDN'T BE PUTTING IN REZONING APPLICATIONS, BUT THEY MIGHT STILL HAVE TO PUT IN REZONING APPLICATIONS FOR A CHANGE IN BUSINESS USE OR SOMETHING. SO THIS IS A REVENUE NUMBER THAT, YOU KNOW, JODI AND I TALK ABOUT. AND IT'S LIKE, OKAY, THIS THIS COULD STILL EXIST EVEN IF THERE ISN'T ANY ONGOING NEWENT. AND TS ONE THAT WE'RE WORKING ON SO THAT THEY'VE ACTUALLY TAKEN IT. 
          I WASN'T VERY I DIDN'T HAVE A LOT OF FAITH IN IT, BUT WE ARE COLLECTING IN SOME ADDITIONAL FEES AND REVIEW NUMBERS. UTILITY TAX, PROPANE. I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THEM, BUT THEY ARE REALLY KICKING IT THIS YEAR. SO JUST BEFORE YOU GO, YES, SIR. SO IN THE PRESENTATION YOU GAVE US A COUPLE WEEKS AGO, YOU HAD UNDER BUILDING PERMIT FEE, 1,421,400. YES, SIR. WHAT IS THE COMPARABLE NUMBER UP THERE? IT'S NOT IT'S NOT UP HERE. THAT ONE. SO THIS 1,000,004. OKAY. THAT WAS A NUMBER BASED ON A BUDGET OF A DEPARTMENT. AND WHAT WE EXPECT TO COLLECT WITH INDIRECT COST. THAT DEPARTMENT HAS MADE SOME CUTS. SO I HAD TO REDUCE THAT NUMBER IN PAST YEARS. MAYOR, WHAT I'VE EXPLAINED IS THE WHAT THE CITY KNOWS IS BUILDING PERMIT FEES FOR BUDGETARY PURPOSES. WE SET IT EQUAL TO THE AMOUNT OF THE BUILDING AND PERMITTING DEPARTMENT'S BUDGET, PLUS THE CITY'S INDIRECT COST, BECAUSE BY FLORIDA STATE STATUTE, YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO CHARGE ANY MORE THAN IT COST TO ISSUE THE PERMITS IN THE SUBSEQUENT IN THAT YEAR. IF YOU COLLECT MORE MONEY THAN WHAT IT COSTS TO ISSUE THE PERMITS, YOU PUT THE MONEY INTO A RESERVE ACCOUNT. IF IT COSTS YOU LESS TO ISSUE THE PERMITS THAN WHAT YOU SPENT, YOU DIP INTO THAT RESERVE. AND SO AT THE PREVIOUS MEETING, I HAD SAID, WE WAIT TO SEE AT THE END OF THE YEAR HOW MUCH WE ACTUALLY ACTUALLY COLLECT IN BUILDING PERMITS TO FIND OUT IF WE ADD TO THE RESERVE OR SUBTRACT FROM IT. AND I HAD SAID THAT AT THIS POINT IN TIME, YEAR TO DATE, BUILDING PERMITS WERE DOWN 60%. SO WE WE'VE NOT COLLECTED ACTUAL PERMIT REVENUE EQUAL TO THE AMOUNT OF THE DEPARTMENT BUDGET YET. SO MILLION FOR 21 MINUS SIX, SIX AND 20 IS $840,000 LESS. UNFORTUNATELY, COMMISSIONER, THERE IS A RESERVE ACCOUNT THAT HAS MONEY IN IT STORED AWAY FROM PRIOR YEARS, WHERE THE CITY DID COLLECT MORE IN PERMIT FEES THAN WHAT WE CHARGED TO ISSUE THEM. AND SO IN A YEAR LIKE THIS YEAR, WHERE THAT DEPARTMENT'S BUDGET WILL BE MORE THAN WHAT WE COLLECT IN REVENUE, GENERAL FUND WON'T BE PENALIZED FOR THAT BECAUSE WE'LL ACTUALLY BE ABLE TO DRAW DOWN THAT RESERVE ACCOUNT TO MAKE OURSELVES WHOLE. SO WE'RE ACTUALLY DRAWING DOWN OUR RESERVES. YOU WOULD DRAW DOWN THAT RESERVE, SIR? YES, SIR. BUT GENERAL FUND, IT WOULD BE A WASH. YOU'D BE AT ZERO. AND SO THIS IS THE FIRST YEAR IN MANY YEARS THAT THE THAT WE WILL BE DRAWING ON THAT RESERVE, WHICH IS I MEAN, YOU KNOW, THE RESERVES BEEN SITTING THERE SEGREGATED. SO WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT OUR, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE BUILDING FUND, WE HAVE EMPLOYEES THAT ARE EXCLUSIVELY PAID FROM DEVELOPMENT FEES, AND WE HAVE EXPENSES THAT ARE EXCLUSIVELY PAID FROM DEVELOPMENT FEES. IN THE PAST, THAT FUND HAS GOTTEN A FUND BALANCE. AND SO IN A YEAR LIKE 
          [00:30:04]
THIS YEAR, WHEN THE AMOUNT OF MONEY COLLECTED DOESN'T MEET THE AMOUNT OF MONEY FOR THE EMPLOYEES, THE PEOPLE IN IT, WE DRAW FROM THE RESERVE TO PAY THE STAFF TO PAY THOSE BILLS. 
          HOWEVER, AS IT RELATES TO A DIRECTION TO THE CITY COMMISSION, WHERE THE CITY COMMISSION TOLD ME TO REDUCE THE AD VALOREM BY ONE MILLAGE POINT, WELL, IT WOULDN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE IF I FIRED EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THE IN THAT DEPARTMENT, BECAUSE THEY DON'T GET $1 OF THE AD VALOREM FUNDS THAT COME IN ANYWAY, AND IT DOESN'T MAKE A DIFFERENCE IF WE HIRE AN ADDITIONAL CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICER FROM THAT DEPARTMENT, BECAUSE THAT DOESN'T IMPACT THE AD VALOREM, BECAUSE THEY DON'T GET PAID WITH THE AD VALOREM PAYMENTS ANYWAY, THEY GET PAID WITH THOSE DEVELOPMENT FEES. HOWEVER, THERE'S STILL REDUCTION IN STAFFING IN THERE BECAUSE THOSE NUMBERS ARE DOWN. THE FINANCE DIRECTOR IS JUST POINTING OUT TO YOU THAT WHATEVER MATH WE'RE PLAYING WITH IN THAT PARTICULAR DEPARTMENT IS NOT THE AD VALOREM RATE DOESN'T MATTER BECAUSE IT'S 100% DEPENDENT ON PERMITTING FEES TO GENERATE THE FUNDING FOR IT, AND THE STAFF IS 100% PAID WITH THOSE FEES. SO WHEN THEY'RE NOT THERE, THE FUND BALANCE HAS TO PAY THEM. AND IF THAT FUND BALANCE WENT TO ZERO, IT WOULD JUST BE OVER WITH. THEY JUST WOULDN'T BE ANYBODY LEFT. IT'S NOT AT ZERO, THANKFULLY, SO WE DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THAT TODAY. HOW MANY YEARS DO WE DRAW DOWN THAT? WELL, THE RATE OF 840,000 A YEAR, PROBABLY TWO. 
          BUT YEAH, THAT WOULD BE IT. SO THAT'S NOT BALANCING YOUR BUDGET. THAT'S ROBBING PETER TO PAY PAUL. WELL THAT'S WELL SO UNFORTUNATELY THE BUILDING FEE BUDGET IF I IT'S HARD TO TALK ABOUT THE BUDGET IN ISOLATION. ANY APPLICATION FEES BUT BUT IT'S AN ISOLATED SO THAT THE BUDGET WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS ALL OF THE FUNDS AND THE BUILDING FEE DEPARTMENT BUDGET IS JUST THE BUILDING FEE DEPARTMENT BUDGET. SO YES, IF WE DIDN'T GET ANOTHER BUILDING APPLICATION EVER, THEN THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT WOULD SOON RUN OUT OF MONEY, AND THERE'D ALSO BE NOTHING FOR ANYBODY TO DO IN THAT DEPARTMENT BECAUSE THERE WOULDN'T BE ANY, ANY, ANY SERVICES BEING RENDERED. BUT THAT ISN'T GENERALLY THE CASE. OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, WE GET APPLICATIONS, WE GET CODE ENFORCEMENT, WE GET ADDITIONS, WE GET, YOU KNOW, PROJECTS OR WHATEVER. SO FAR, WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE IN A ZONING IN PROGRESS. RIGHT. WELL, WHO KNOWS WHAT'S GOING ON THERE. WE'LL WAIT AND SEE. WELL, THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT AND THE PERMITTING EMPLOYEES UP THERE, THE EMPLOYEES WHO ARE, YOU KNOW, THE BUILDING OFFICIAL AND THE PERMIT TECHS EXISTED BEFORE THE CREATION OF THE RESERVE. SO AND BACK DURING ONE OF THE GO GO YEARS, THE STATE OF FLORIDA PASSED A STATUTE THAT SAID, YOU MUST CREATE THIS PERMIT RESERVE. 
          AND THE MONEY GOES WENT INTO THAT RESERVE. WE'VE DIPPED INTO IT A COUPLE TIMES. THERE'S BEEN A COUPLE YEARS WHERE THE PERMITS COLLECTED WERE LESS THAN THE DEPARTMENT'S BUDGET. SO WE DIPPED SLIGHTLY INTO THE RESERVE. BUT MOST YEARS THE ACTUAL PERMIT REVENUES COLLECTED EXCEEDS THE DEPARTMENT'S BUDGET. AND THAT EXCESS IS WHAT GOES INTO THE RESERVE. SO RIGHT NOW AND THIS IS ONE OF THOSE THINGS LIKE IF, IF THE MANAGER SAID, WELL, LET'S CUT THAT MILLION FOR, YOU KNOW, OR LET'S CUT THE WHOLE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, I'D BE LIKE, WELL, THAT DIDN'T SAVE US ANYTHING BECAUSE IT WAS COMPLETELY FUNDED BY THE RESERVE. SO IT'S A WASH. IT WOULD BE LIKE CUTTING THE TRAM. THE CRA PAYS FOR THE TRAM. SO IF I CUT THE TRAM, IT DOESN'T REALLY HELP GENERAL FUNDS BUDGET, BECAUSE I'D ALSO LOSE THE REVENUE FROM THE CRA THAT PAYS FOR THE TRAM. SO THIS IS A VERY SIMILAR SITUATION. IF WE CUT THE BUILDING PERMIT, IT DOESN'T GET IF WE CUT THAT DEPARTMENT, IT DOESN'T GET GENERAL FUND ANYWHERE BECAUSE IT'S FULLY FUNDED RIGHT NOW BY THE RESERVE. AND ALONG THOSE COMMENTS THAT ONE OF THE COMMENTS THAT WAS MADE BY THE BOARD AT THE LAST ONE, WHEN WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE MILLAGE RATES, WAS RELATED TO DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS AND THE WAY THAT THE CITY'S BUDGET HAS ALWAYS WORKED IS JUST FOR A BRIEF HISTORY, IS THE CITY HAS HISTORICALLY AND IT'S NOT JUST ME. SO THOSE OF YOU THAT OWN WALMART DON'T BLAME ME, BUT HAS PUT THE BRUNT OF ITS FINANCIAL OBLIGATIONS ONTO TOURISTS AND LARGE CORPORATE ENTITIES. AND WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO SEE WHEN HE'S GOING THROUGH SOME OF THE SLIDES COMING UP, IS THAT OUR TEN LARGEST RESIDENTIAL TAXPAYERS ARE ACTUALLY APARTMENT BUILDINGS, NOT RESIDENTIAL HOMES. AND THEY PAY MORE THAN I THINK THE 2000 LOWEST TAXPAYERS. 
          AND WHEN YOU GET INTO THE SEPARATION OF THE RESIDENTIAL AND THE COMMERCIAL, WHAT WHAT 
          [00:35:03]
YOU FIND IS THAT IN THE SO USING A RESIDENTIAL TAXES, IF A PERSON'S HOUSE WAS CURRENTLY WORTH $500,000, BUT THEY WERE HOMESTEADED, SO IT WAS ASSESSED AT $400,000, THE 0.25 MILLAGE WOULD REDUCE THEIR TAXES BY $100 PER YEAR. IT WOULD THEN THEIR HOUSE WOULD BE ASSESSED AT $412,000, BECAUSE THE HOMESTEAD WOULD ALLOW IT TO GO UP BY 3% PER YEAR, AND THEY COULD BE FACING AS MUCH AS A $240 INCREASE IN THEIR TAXES, WHICH WOULD THEN MAKE THE $100 SAVINGS ACTUALLY RESULT IN A $140 INCREASE, INSTEAD OF A $240 INCREASE IN THEIR TOTAL TAX BILL. HOWEVER, THE COMMERCIAL PLAYERS DO NOT HAVE ANY OF THOSE EXEMPTIONS, AND AS A RESULT, THE TOP TAXPAYERS WOULD BE RECEIVING SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 10 AND $15,000 A YEAR EACH FROM THAT REDUCTION IN THE CITY'S MILLAGE RATE. AND THEN THE NEXT TIER DOWN WOULD BE GETTING 5 TO $10,000 EACH, AND THEN THE NEXT TIER DOWN WOULD BE 0 TO $5000 EACH. AND THEN YOU GET INTO THE REAL RESIDENTIAL NUMBERS, WHICH I DON'T THINK THAT WE HAVE ANY RESIDENTIAL NUMBERS THAT ARE GOING TO GET THAT WOULD GET $1,000 A YEAR IN SAVINGS. AND WHAT WE'VE DONE IS WE'VE SHIFTED IT. SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE ZONING MAP OF STUART, YOU SEE THIS RED THAT GOES DOWN US ONE. WELL THAT RED IS GENERALLY WHAT PAYS THE VAST MAJORITY OF OUR AD VALOREM VALOREM. IT ALSO PAYS THE INTANGIBLE TAX. IT ALSO PAYS THE UTILITY TAXES. IT ALSO PAYS THE BUSINESS TAXES, THE LOCAL BUSINESS TAX, THE FRANCHISE FEES AND OTHERS BECAUSE IT'S THE BUSINESSES THAT ARE THAT ARE PAYING THOSE NUMBERS. SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THESE DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS, LIKE THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, OUR PUBLIC SAFETY COSTS APPROXIMATELY $23 MILLION A YEAR, AND AD VALOREM, WHICH IS USED TO PAY FOR OUR PUBLIC SAFETY, GENERATES APPROXIMATELY. $17,365,051 PER YEAR. SO WE'RE $6 MILLION SHORT WITH AD VALOREM. BEFORE WE GET STARTED. AND WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE PUTS AND TAKES, WHAT WE ACTUALLY WOULD BE DOING IS IN THE WHEN WE COME UP SHORT ON THE AD VALOREM, REGARDLESS OF WHAT IT'S IN. OTHER GENERAL FUND REVENUES FILL THOSE GAPS, WHETHER IT'S THE COMMERCIAL FUND THAT WHERE WE HAVE PROPERTY THAT THE CITY RENTS OUT OR THE PROPERTY MANAGEMENT FUND, OR WHETHER IT'S THE FLORIDA POWER AND LIGHT UTILITY TAX THAT'S GENERATED, YOU CAN SEE WE GET ABOUT $2.5 MILLION A YEAR FROM THAT. AND I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OF YOU HAD A CHANCE TO READ THE JOINT MEETING WITH THE COUNTY AND INDIANTOWN AND THE SCHOOL BOARD FROM A COUPLE OF WEEKS AGO, BUT WHAT PART OF THE PRESENTATION, TERRY AND KRISTA WAS SHOWING US A DATA CENTER THAT INDIANTOWN IS GOING TO BE BUILDING. AND IF THAT DATA CENTER ENDS UP BEING WHAT'S CONSIDERED A SMALL DATA CENTER AND ENDS UP USING WHAT'S CONSIDERED LOW WATTAGE USE, WHICH WOULD BE 30,000,000KW PER MONTH, AND FLORIDA POWER AND LIGHT CUTS THE RATE FROM $0.16 PER KILOWATT HOUR TO $0.09 PER KILOWATT HOUR. INDIANTOWN IS GOING TO BE RECEIVING IN EXCESS OF $4 MILLION A YEAR. JUST FROM THAT SINGLE BUSINESSES UTILITY TAX ALONE, THEIR AD VALOREM, THEIR OTHER TAXES, THEIR BUSINESS TAX RECEIPTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. AND I DON'T HAVE I DON'T THINK JODY'S IN HERE RIGHT NOW. BUT LIKE IF I USE COSTCO, I THINK THE COSTCO CAN YOU DO YOU KNOW THE NUMBER THAT COSTCO PAID IN IN BUSINESS TAX? YEAH, COSTCO PAID ALMOST $300,000 LAST YEAR IN BUSINESS TAX RECEIPTS TO GET OPEN AND OPEN UP. SO THOSE TYPES OF COMMERCIAL EXPENSES IS WHAT WE GET. THE, THE MAJORITY OF OUR FUNDS FROM TO THEN PAY THESE SHORTFALLS I GUESS FOR LACK OF A BETTER DESCRIPTION. MR. MAYOR, I HAVE A QUESTION. CAN I JUST CLARIFY THE FUND FROM THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT? IS THAT JUST A FUND WHERE IF THERE'S SHORT IN PAYING SALARIES, WHATNOT, YOU'RE USING THE FUND OR THAT FUND IS PAYING THE WHOLE 
          [00:40:03]
DEPARTMENT SALARY? AND AS AS JULIE POINTED OUT, AS THE FINANCE DIRECTOR POINTED OUT, WHAT WE DO IS IT'S EXACTLY WHAT THE OPERATIONAL COST OF THAT DEPARTMENT IS. SO IF THE OPERATIONAL COST OF THAT DEPARTMENT IS $1,415 OR $1,450,734, THAT'S WHAT WE BUDGET. IF THEY BRING IN MORE THAN THAT, THE MONEY GOES INTO THE RESERVE AND WE CAN'T USE IT FOR GENERAL FUND OR FOR OTHER OPERATIONAL EXPENSES, AND IT HAS TO STAY IN THE RESERVES. IF THEY BRING IN $1 MILLION, LET'S SAY, THEN 400,000 WOULD COME OUT OF THE RESERVES TO BALANCE THE OPERATION OF THEIR ACCOUNT. IT'S NOT PAYING FOR IT TOTALLY. IT'S JUST IT'S 100% OF IT, NO MATTER WHAT. IF IT DOESN'T COME UP WITH ENOUGH MONEY, IF WE DON'T GET ENOUGH APPLICATION FEES, THEN THE RESERVES THAT WE HAD WOULD BE USED TO PAY FOR IT BEFORE THE STATE LAW THAT CAME INTO EFFECT THAT MADE US CREATE A BUILDING FUND ACCOUNT LIKE THAT SHOULD BE NOTED THAT THE ACCOUNT ALSO SAID THAT STATE LAW WASN'T JUST A, YOU KNOW, MAKE A BANK ACCOUNT. IT SAID THAT YOU MUST UTILIZE ALL YOUR FUNDS, AND IF YOU DON'T, AND YOU RESERVE AND BUILD UP TOO MUCH IN THAT ACCOUNT, YOU HAVE TO REDUCE ALL OF YOUR FEES SO THAT THE DEVELOPERS AND THE APPLICANTS DON'T HAVE TO PAY AS MUCH. SO THERE'S A BALANCE THERE THAT WE CAN'T JUST CRANK THOSE FEES UP AND HAVE $50 MILLION IN RESERVES THERE. IT'S GOT TO BE BALANCED, BUT WE USE IT TO COMPLETELY OPERATE THE DEPARTMENT, AND THE BUILDING FUND PAYS FOR LITERALLY THE COMPUTERS, THE OFFICE CHAIRS, THE FLOORING, THE ELECTRIC BILL, EVERYTHING. SALARIES, SALARIES. FOR US IN THE LINE WHERE THERE'S EMPLOYEE SALARIES, BENEFITS AND WHATNOT. THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT IS NOT INCLUDED. WELL, IN WHICH LINE IF IN THE WHOLE BUDGET, IF YOU SAY HOW MANY EMPLOYEES ARE IN THE CITY OF STUART, THERE'S ROUGHLY 300 THAN IT IS BECAUSE THERE'S THIS EXCESS. BUT BUT BY THE WAY, THAT WORKS IN. SO LET ME LET ME THE UTILITIES DEPARTMENT HAS UTILITY FEES THAT ARE A SPECIFIC AMOUNT THAT ARE BUDGETED THAT ARE UTILITIES. SO IN THE IN THE GARBAGE COLLECTION DEPARTMENT, THOSE EMPLOYEES ARE PAID WITH GARBAGE COLLECTION FEES AS WELL. AND SO IF YOU DON'T COLLECT GARBAGE, THERE ISN'T ANY MONEY TO PAY THEM IN THE WATER RECLAMATION DEPARTMENT. THOSE EMPLOYEES ARE PAID WITH SEWER FEES. AND SO IF THEY DON'T COLLECT THEM, THEY DON'T GET PAID IN THE WATER TREATMENT DEPARTMENT. THEY'RE NOT IN THE GENERAL LINE OF EMPLOYEE PAYMENTS AND BENEFITS. 
          POLICE AND FIRE WIPE OUT THE GENERAL LINE OF EMPLOYEE PAYMENTS AND BENEFITS. ALL OF THE EMPLOYEES ARE IN THE GENERAL LINE, AND IT SHOWS THE TOTAL FOR THE EMPLOYEES. BUT EACH SUB-DEPARTMENT OR ENTERPRISE FUND HAS THE FUNDING FOR THOSE. RIGHT? THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER. 
          HOLD ON COMMISSIONER, LET ME I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTOOD YOUR QUESTION. SO THE EMPLOYEES OF THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, IF YOU LOOK AT GENERAL FUND AND THERE'S A BUDGET REPORT IN THE BUDGET EVERY YEAR THAT HAS HERE'S THE TOTAL SALARIES OF GENERAL FUND, HERE'S THE TOTAL OVERTIME OF GENERAL FUND. HERE'S THE FICA OF GENERAL FUND. THOSE BUILDING EMPLOYEES ARE IN THAT LINE, BUT THEY ARE IN THAT LINE OKAY. BUT THERE IS A REVENUE EQUAL TO THAT EXPENSE IN THE REVENUE PART OF THE BUDGET. OKAY. AND SO IF THAT EXPENSE FOR THAT BUILDING DEPARTMENT GOES DOWN, THEN THAT REVENUE GOES DOWN. IF THAT EXPENSE FOR THAT DEPARTMENT GOES UP, THEN THAT REVENUE GOES UP UNTIL THE RESERVE IS GONE AT SUCH POINT. AND THEN AT THAT POINT, IF WE DECIDED TO KEEP THE DEPARTMENT AND WE DIDN'T ISSUE ANOTHER PERMIT TO THE MANAGER'S SCENARIO A MOMENT AGO, WELL, THEN AD VALOREM WOULD RIGHT PICK UP THE COST OF THOSE EMPLOYEES IF YOU WANTED TO CONTINUE TO EMPLOY THEM. RIGHT. BUT CLEARLY, WITH A SHORTFALL LIKE THAT, AT SOME POINT WE'RE GOING TO START ASKING QUESTIONS. RIGHT? RIGHT NOW I COULDN'T DO IT. YEAH. AD VALOREM SUPPORTED THAT FUNCTION PREVIOUSLY. NOW, WE'VE BEEN FORTUNATE ENOUGH THAT THE RESERVE HAS BEEN, YOU KNOW, LARGE ENOUGH TO KEEP FUNDING THAT PERMANENT RESERVE. NOW, IF THIS WAS TWO YEARS DOWN THE ROAD AND AS ALL THESE SCENARIOS ARE THROWN OUT THERE TODAY, TWO YEARS DOWN THE ROAD, WE HAVEN'T ISSUED ANY PERMITS. AND YOU SAY, HEY, THERE'S A MILLION FOR HERE. 
          WELL, GENERAL FUNDS PICKING UP THAT TAB, NOT THE RESERVE, BECAUSE THE RESERVE WOULD BE GONE. AND I JUST WANT TO SAY EVERYBODY IN THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, THIS IS NOT A CONVERSATION. THIS IS JUST A THIS IS JUST A WHAT IF THESE ARE HYPOTHETICAL DISCUSSIONS FOR A WORKSHOP AND ALSO TO THE TO THE COMMISSIONERS, THE SHORTFALL IS NOT HYPOTHETICAL. WELL, NO, THE SHORTFALL THE SHORTFALL IN AD VALOREM IS AN HYPOTHETICAL EITHER. WELL, NO, NO, NO, THE SHORTFALL IN PERMIT REVENUES HAS BEEN DRAWN DOWN. IS NOT IS NOT A FAKE NUMBER. AND WE WILL DIP INTO THAT RESERVE THIS YEAR. I JUST DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH YET. UNTIL 930 SEPTEMBER 30TH. ALSO 
          [00:45:04]
FOR THE COMMISSIONERS, THAT STATUTE SAID YOU COULDN'T USE THIS MONEY TO OFFSET TAXES OR LIKE YOU COULDN'T BUY DOWN YOUR MILLAGE OR YOUR TAXES. WITH THE PERMIT RESERVE. IT COULD ONLY BE SPENT ON PERMITS. OKAY, MR. CLARK, THE QUESTION. YES? I, I GUESS IN THE IN THE BEGINNING OF HIS. PRESENTATION. AN HOUR. SO THIS IS ALL ABOUT FUNDING SOURCES. AND EVEN THOUGH THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT IS SUPPOSEDLY A EXEMPT OR I JUST THE DISCUSSION, I THINK PEOPLE WANT TO KNOW WHERE THOSE PUTS AND TAKES CAME FROM AND HOW MANY EMPLOYEES WOULD BE AFFECTED BY A MILLION PLUS SHORTFALL AND WHAT WOULD HAPPEN. I THINK PEOPLE WANT TO SEE TODAY WHAT IS. WHAT YOU'RE WORKING WITH. SO THE CURRENTLY YOU'RE LOOKING AT A REDUCTION ALREADY OF PROBABLY EIGHT FULL TIME EMPLOYEES. AND THEN THE FOUR B THAT WAS ON THE FIRST PAGE COULD BE A NUMBER BETWEEN 0 AND 8 MORE, IF THAT'S WHAT YOU WERE REFERRING TO. BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT NUMBER IS YET. AND SO FOR EXAMPLE, AND THIS IS AGAIN, THE GUY THAT DRIVES THE GARBAGE TRUCK THAT I'M REFERRING TO RIGHT NOW IS NOT GETTING FIRED. SO PLEASE DON'T THINK YOU ARE. BUT IN THE EVENT THAT THE GUY THAT DRIVES THE GARBAGE TRUCK WAS TERMINATED DURING THIS BUDGET PROCESS. WE'D HAVE TO TURN AROUND AND HIRE ANOTHER PERSON TO DRIVE A GARBAGE TRUCK, BECAUSE YOU CAN'T NOT PICK UP THE GARBAGE. SO AS WE'RE GOING THROUGH THIS PROCESS TO REMOVE POSITIONS FROM THE CITY OF STUART, I CAN'T REMOVE POSITIONS THAT I KNOW THE DAY AFTERWARDS, I'M GOING TO GET A REQUEST TO REHIRE THAT POSITION TO REPLACE THAT PERSON, BECAUSE TWO THINGS HAPPEN. YEAH. 
          HISTORICALLY, WHEN THEY DID A EARLY RETIREMENT, BACK WHEN DAVE ROSS WAS THE CITY MANAGER, HE OFFERED THIS THING TO DO A BUDGET REDUCTION AND OFFERED A BUNCH OF PEOPLE EARLY RETIREMENT, AND A BUNCH OF PEOPLE ACCEPTED IT, AND IT ENDED UP COSTING THE CITY $600,000, BECAUSE WHEN WE WENT TO REHIRE ALL THOSE POSITIONS THAT THE PEOPLE THAT HAD BEEN WORKING IN LEFT, IT TURNED OUT THAT THE MARKET, ACTUALLY THOSE POSITIONS WERE BEING PAID MORE THAN THE PEOPLE WERE ACTUALLY EARNING THAT LEFT. SO IT COST MORE TO PUT NEW PEOPLE IN THE POSITIONS. 
          OBVIOUSLY, WE'RE NOT SUGGESTING THAT PROPOSAL HERE, BUT IT MAY BE BRINGING THAT UP. WELL, I SUGGEST IT BECAUSE I'M NOT GETTING RID OF PEOPLE THAT ARE GOING TO COST US MORE TO REPLACE THE NEXT DAY. THERE'D BE NO BENEFIT TO THAT, RIGHT? IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE. WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS FIND POSITIONS THAT WOULD NOT BE REPLACED, THAT WOULD NEVER COME BACK, THAT WON'T EXIST ANY LONGER. AND WHATEVER DEPARTMENT THAT'S IN, IT JUST SIMPLY IS GOING TO REDUCE THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE DOING WHATEVER THAT SERVICE IS, RIGHT? MR. CLARK, COMPETITION QUESTION I THINK I MIGHT HAVE A FOLLOW UP. YEAH. NO, NO. SO AND THAT'S LOOKING AT THE POTENTIAL FOR THE 4.75. MILLAGE RATE OR, OR JUST KEEPING IT AT THE FIVE. IF WE KEEP IT AT THE FIVE, WE'RE NOT AS BEHIND. SO I MEAN OUR DISCUSSION HERE IS TO FIND OUT IF WE DO BRING IT DOWN. WE KNOW THAT WE BRING IT DOWN. WE'RE GOING TO HURT PEOPLE. THE ISSUE IS HOW MUCH IN THE AGGREGATE IS BEST FOR THE CITY AT LARGE OR THE BUDGET WHEN THINGS ARE AGGREGATED FOR THE BUDGET VERSUS WHAT IT IMPACTS AN INDIVIDUAL PROPERTY TAX PAYER, WHETHER IT'S THE RESIDENTIAL, WE PROBABLY DON'T SEE THAT MUCH. BUT IT'S A COMMERCIAL THAT THAT WE'LL SEE. AND I JUST I MEAN, I THINK THAT WE NEED WE'LL LISTEN TO JOLLY, BUT I THINK WE NEED TO, TO DECIDE IF YOU'RE GOING TO KEEP SHAVING THIS BUDGET BASED ON, ARE WE GOING TO DO IT AT THE 4.75. ARE WE GOING TO KEEP FIVE? BELIEVE? MR. VICE MAYOR? I BELIEVE THAT COMMISSIONER REED WAS NEXT. YES. NO. YES, MAYOR. 
          OH, SORRY. I DIDN'T SEE YOUR CARD. SO I THINK IT'S EASY TO GET LOST IN WHY THIS IS 
          [00:50:03]
RELEVANT. TALKING ABOUT BRINGING THE MILLAGE DOWN. REALLY, IT'S NOT THE PLACE OF US TO GET INTO THE WEEDS TOO MUCH WITH REGARD TO PARTICULAR EXPENSES. THAT'S WHAT WE'VE HIRED MIKE TO DO. THE ONE LEVER THAT WE HAVE TO PULL TO DIRECT STAFF IS MILLAGE. THAT'S REALLY OUR ONLY LEVER. WE CAN DISCUSS DIFFERENT, BUT IT'S NOT APPROPRIATE FOR US TO SAY WE SHOULD HIRE MORE PEOPLE OR FIRE PEOPLE IN ANY PARTICULAR DEPARTMENT. BUT IF WE LOOK AT THE OVERALL ENVIRONMENT ECONOMICALLY, WE'RE IN A BIT OF A PERFECT STORM. ONE, WE HAVE THE COVID YEARS NOW OVER. THERE WAS A LOT OF GOVERNMENT SPENDING, A LOT OF MONEY COMING OUR WAY. TO MIKE'S POINT ABOUT ARPA MONEY, THAT WAS JUST A LOT OF MONEY AND GROWTH IN GOVERNMENT. THAT ERA IS OVER, AND AT SOME POINT, YOU HAVE TO START HAVING THOSE DIFFICULT DISCUSSIONS ABOUT HOW DO YOU START TO CONSOLIDATE SO THAT THE GOVERNMENT CAN CONTINUE TO FUNCTION AND PERFORM THE LEVEL OF SERVICE PEOPLE WANT. BUT ON TOP OF THAT, YOU ALSO HAVE BLAZE, MAGNOLIA. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS FOLLOW THE NEW STATE CFO THAT RON APPOINTED RECENTLY. THIS GUY IS GOING AROUND TALKING ABOUT DOING AUDITS WITH EVERYBODY. HE IS. I'VE LISTENED TO SOME OF BECAUSE I'M TRYING TO GET A SENSE OF WHAT'S WHAT'S THE STATE'S TAKE ON WHAT MUNICIPALITIES ARE DOING. AND BLAZE IS TALKING ABOUT IN THE NEXT ELECTION CYCLE, THEM PUSHING THAT CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT TO DO AWAY WITH PROPERTY TAXES THAT MAY OR MAY NOT HAPPEN, BUT I THINK WE SHOULD BE, AS A BOARD, THINKING ABOUT WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE? IT'S NOT JUST, YOU KNOW, SIGNALING FROM RON DESANTIS. IT'S HAPPENING. I'M SEEING CONSISTENT AND NOW ACTIONABLE DIRECTION ALONG THAT. THE CITY OF STUART AND MARTIN COUNTY WOULD BE PARTICULARLY HIT HARD BY THAT, BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE POPULATION TO REALLY GET A LOT OF MONEY OUT OF SALES TAX, ASSUMING THAT THAT IS WHERE THAT MONEY COMES FROM. I THINK THAT WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT HOW DO WE START TO REFINE? WHAT WE'RE DOING IN TERMS OF PERSONNEL SO THAT WE'RE NOT HIT SO HARD THAT WE EITHER HAVE TO RAISE TAXES, RIGHT? SO IF SOMETHING LIKE THAT HAPPENED IN THE 26TH CYCLE, YOU HAVE BASICALLY TWO YEARS TO FIGURE OUT HOW YOU'RE SPENDING MONEY IN YOUR GOVERNMENT. AND THAT'S IT. YEAH. ONCE THE PROPERTY TAXES ARE REMOVED, YOU'VE GOT A TWO YEAR PERIOD TO FIGURE THAT OUT. AND MY CONCERN WOULD BE YOU LOSE YOUR FIRE DEPARTMENT. MY CONCERN WOULD BE THAT THE CITY DRAMATICALLY HAS TO CUT WHERE WE CAN START A TREND. AND I KNOW IT. IT'S PAINFUL TO TALK ABOUT. IT MAKES EVERYBODY NERVOUS AND UNCOMFORTABLE WHO MIGHT GET FIRED OR WHATEVER. BUT IF WE START PULLING BACK ON THAT MILLAGE NOW, I THINK IT CREATES A TRAJECTORY WHERE YOU'RE REFINING. AND IF THAT PROPERTY TAX THING DOESN'T HAPPEN AND IT'S JUST TALKING POINT, FANTASTIC. WE CAN START TO PUSH BACK AND GO IN THAT OTHER DIRECTION. BUT THE LAST THING I'LL COUPLE ON TOP OF THAT WAS TO YOUR POINT ABOUT THE INCREASES IN PROPERTY TAXES COMING IN. WE'VE BEEN SEEING PREVIOUSLY DOUBLE DIGIT INCREASES. AND TO YOUR POINT, WE SAW IN THIS LAST ROUND A SINGLE DIGIT INCREASE, I BELIEVE IT WENT DOWN TO SEVEN. YEAH, THIS IS ONE OF ANOTHER COMPOUNDING FACTOR THAT YOU NEED TO LOOK AT. 
          WITH AN INCREASE IN OUR PROPERTY TAXES. WE ARE STILL SHORT $3.9 MILLION. THE TRAJECTORY OF THAT HAS GONE FROM DOUBLE DIGIT INCREASES NOW TO SINGLE. THAT'S STARTING TO SHAVE OFF AS A BUSINESS OWNER, WHEN YOU'RE SEEING YOUR REVENUE DECREASING, YOU NEED TO COUPLE THAT WITH A DECREASE IN SPENDING OR YOU'RE ABOUT TO BE IN A SERIOUS PROBLEM. NOW, IT MAY JUST SO HAPPEN THAT TRUMP DOES MAGIC WITH TARIFFS OR I DON'T KNOW, SOME JUJITSU HAPPENS IN THE MARKET. AND ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU'RE BACK TO DOUBLE DIGIT INCREASES. AND AGAIN NOW YOU CAN START TALKING ABOUT I MADE THE POINT LAST TIME AND I WASN'T TRYING TO BE HARD ON YOU GUYS. 
          YOU CAN TALK ABOUT CAPTAINS OR THESE THINGS. YOU KNOW YOU GOT MONEY. THERE'S MORE MONEY COMING IN. WE'RE ON A RISE. BUT ALL OF THESE FACTORS RIGHT NOW, IF YOU KEEP YOUR MILLAGE AT FIVE, IF YOU DON'T CUT YOUR SPENDING, I THINK YOU'RE LOOKING AT REALLY IF ANY ONE OF THEM IS TO HIT, 
          [00:55:01]
YOU COULD HAVE ISSUES, LET ALONE ALL OF THIS TOGETHER. SO I, I DON'T APPRECIATE THE TALKING POINT ABOUT RESIDENTIAL VERSUS COMMERCIAL. AND, YOU KNOW, THE AVERAGE HOMEOWNER WILL ONLY SEE $0.50 OF DECREASE IN THEIR PROPERTY TAXES. AND, YOU KNOW, WALMART WILL GET OFF THE HOOK. I DON'T THINK IT MATTERS, REALLY, WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DECREASING SPENDING. REALLY, I'M SMALL GOVERNMENT. I'M CONSERVATIVE. YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT TAXES, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO BENEFITS FROM A TAX DECREASE. WE SHOULD. IF WE'RE SEEING INCREASES IN PROPERTY TAXES, WE SHOULD WANT TO SEE RESIDENTS AND BUSINESS OWNERS RECEIVING SOME PORTION OF THAT NET. IT SHOULDN'T JUST BE HOW HOW MUCH MORE MONEY WE HAVE TO SPEND IN GOVERNMENT AS WELL. 
          SO. THOSE THOSE ARE MY GENERAL THOUGHTS. I HOPE THAT BY THE TIME THIS IS OVER, YOU GUYS CAN MAKE IT WORK. AT THAT POINT, TWO FIVE DECREASE BECAUSE OF THOSE REASONS. YEAH. JULIE, MY QUESTION FOR YOU WAS I'VE AND THIS SHOULD GO TO ALL YOU GUYS. I WOULD REQUEST IT FROM JOLIE. I WAS SENT THE ENTIRE BUDGET BROKEN DOWN. IT HELPS YOU A LOT TO LOOK THROUGH IT, BY THE WAY, INSTEAD OF JUST LOOKING AT THIS STUFF. BECAUSE THAT SCRATCHES THE SURFACE. JOLIE, DO YOU KNOW WHAT WE SPENT LAST YEAR IN OVERTIME FOR EMPLOYEES AT THE CITY? BY CHANCE, I COULD FIND BECAUSE EVERYONE KEEPS TALKING ABOUT LETTING EMPLOYEES GO AND FIRING THEM, BUT I DIDN'T KNOW IF IT WAS EASY FOR YOU TO FIND. I MEAN, I CAN'T I DIDN'T HAVE THAT REPORT OPEN, BUT I WILL OPEN IT RIGHT NOW. OKAY. TO THAT, TO THAT POINT, COMMISSIONER, IT'S ALWAYS A FINE DANCE BETWEEN US OF WHEN IS IT CHEAPER TO PAY EXISTING PEOPLE OVERTIME? VERSUS DID YOU GENERATE ENOUGH TO ACTUALLY JUST SAY IT'S CHEAPER TO GET ANOTHER PERSON AND ADD ADD THE, YOU KNOW, THE FRINGE BENEFITS AND EVERYTHING ON IT. SO ALSO WE ALSO NEED TO BREAK THAT DOWN INTO CORRECT BY EACH DEPARTMENT, EACH DEPARTMENT. BECAUSE LIKE I THINK POLICE IS GOING TO BE CLOSE TO $300,000 IN OVERTIME FOR FIRE IS AT $525,000 IN OVERTIME. AND THEN WHEN YOU GET INTO THE UTILITIES, I THINK THERE'S ONE UTILITY THAT HAS ABOUT $100,000 IN OVERTIME. AND THEN THE OTHERS ARE 25,000, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. THEY'RE NOMINAL. THEN YOU GET INTO LIKE THE CLERK DOESN'T HAVE ANY, THE CRA DOESN'T HAVE ANY. THE DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT HAS LESS THAN $10,000. I WAS JUST I WAS CURIOUS BECAUSE LIKE, I SEE IT BUDGETED AT $1 MILLION. AND LIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, MAYBE SOME OF THIS STUFF CAN BE PROJECTED DEPENDING ON THE DEPARTMENT, MAYBE HOLIDAY WEEKENDS. YOU MIGHT KNOW YOU CAN SEND EMPLOYEES HOME EARLIER HURRICANE SEASON. AS FAR AS GARBAGE, I DON'T KNOW. I'M JUST THINKING OUTSIDE THE BOX. I MEAN, YOU GUYS ARE TALKING ABOUT LAYING OFF EMPLOYEES, BUT MAYBE LOOKING AT THE OVERTIME BUDGET, IF IT'S OVER $1 MILLION A YEAR, I DON'T KNOW ANY BUSINESS OWNER THAT RUNS THEIR BUSINESS LIKE THAT. 
          WELL, THEY THE THOSE DEPARTMENTS WOULD TELL YOU THAT WE NEED MORE EMPLOYEES. SO WOULD IT OFFSET THE COST THEN TO LOWER THE I MEAN IT'S WHICH DIRECTION DO YOU GO. RIGHT. THAT'S THE QUESTION. 
          THAT'S JUST AT 930 2024, GENERAL FUND HAD A YEAR TO DATE EXPENSE OF 1,031,000. IN OVERTIME. THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE THE FRINGE BENEFITS. CALCULATE ON IT FICA TAX AND FRS HALF OF THAT. NO. 
          PROBABLY POLICE AND FIRE 76% OF GENERAL FUNDS BUDGET EXPENSE AND SO ONE OF THE PROBLEMS THAT YOU HAVE TRYING TO DO IT IS THAT AND I'M NOT TRYING TO THROW FIRE UNDER THE BUS BY HAVING THE CONVERSATION. IT'S JUST AN EASIER EXAMPLE TO USE IS THAT THE FIRE DEPARTMENT HAS MINIMUM STAFFING STANDARDS. AND SO THEY HAVE TO HAVE CERTAIN GUYS IN CERTAIN POSITIONS. AND IF SOMEBODY'S NOT THERE, SOMEBODY ELSE HAS TO COME IN AND FILL IN FOR THEM. BUT EVERY SINGLE FIREFIGHTER THAT WORKS FOR THE CITY IS ALREADY SCHEDULED FOR 2496 HOURS A YEAR. BASED UPON THE WAY IT WORKS, AND A REGULAR SCHEDULE IS 2080 HOURS A YEAR. BUT THE 2496 GOES INTO THOSE 48 HOUR SHIFTS, OR 48 HOUR PER WEEK SHIFTS, OR 24 HOUR SHIFTS. SO AS A RESULT, ANYTIME A FIREFIGHTER HAS WORKER'S COMP, ANYTIME A FIREFIGHTER TAKES PTO, ANYTIME A FIREFIGHTER GOES OUT ON FM, FMLA, OR IS SICK OR ANYTHING, IT'S OVERTIME. NO, THERE'S NO WE DON'T HAVE BACKUP FULL TIME EMPLOYEES WAITING AROUND TO SEE IF SOMEBODY'S GOING TO BE SICK OR WHATEVER. IT'S GOING TO BE 
          [01:00:02]
IT. EVERY SINGLE TIME SOMEBODY OUT. THE MINIMUM STAFFING REQUIRES SOMEONE ELSE TO COME IN. AND UNFORTUNATELY, THIS YEAR THERE WAS AN ANOMALY OF CIRCUMSTANCES WHERE THERE WAS A WORK COMP ISSUES OR THERE WAS. MILITARY LEAVE. I'M MILITARY LEAVE, RIGHT? WE HAVE SOMEBODY OUT ON MILITARY LEAVE RIGHT NOW THAT SOMEONE GOES ON MILITARY LEAVE, YOU HAVE TO KEEP THEIR POSITION. AND IT'S NINE WEEKS OF OVERTIME EVERY SINGLE TIME, JUST BECAUSE THAT'S HOW IT PLAYS OUT. 
          AND I'M NOT SAYING IT'S ANYBODY'S FAULT. IT'S JUST THAT'S THE NATURE OF THE BEAST. 
          YEAH. AND I WASN'T TARGETING ANY SPECIFIC DEPARTMENT. IT'S JUST I DON'T KNOW. BUT IT'S AND I AGREE WITH YOU THAT IT'S AND FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, DURING THE BUDGET CONVERSATIONS, JOLIE WAS THE ONLY ONE THAT SAID THROUGH ALL OF THEM WITH ME. BUT I HAD SOME SERIOUS CONVERSATIONS ABOUT EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. AND THERE ARE SOME POSITIONS THAT YOU COULD SCHEDULE. I'M GOING TO USE THE CHRISTMAS PARADE, FOR EXAMPLE. I KNOW RIGHT NOW THAT EVERY SINGLE POLICE OFFICER IN OUR POLICE DEPARTMENT IS GOING TO HAVE TO WORK ON THE FIRST FRIDAY IN DECEMBER, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS ON THE FIRST FRIDAY OF EVERY DECEMBER. SO YOU COULD IF THE CHIEF WANTED, HE COULD HAVE NOBODY PATROL THE STREETS ON TUESDAY, WEDNESDAY AND THURSDAY. 
          THAT'S JUST AND THEN BUT BUT IT'S AND AGAIN AND I'M NOT SAYING ZERO BUT I DON'T WANT TO SAY THE NUMBERS THAT ARE PATROLLING. BUT YOU COULD TAKE THEM OFF BECAUSE I KNOW THEY'RE GOING TO BE THERE. I KNOW IT'S OVERTIME. I KNOW THE 4TH OF JULY IS GOING TO BE OVERTIME AS WELL. 
          SO THE KEY TO THAT IS, OKAY, WELL SCHEDULE LESS LEADING UP TO IT. AND THEN UTILITIES FOR EXAMPLE, TALKING WITH PETER ABOUT THAT, WHEN WE HAVE A PIPE BREAK AND IF A PIPE BREAKS ON MONDAY IT'S ALL HANDS ON DECK. SO THEN THE GUYS WORK AND THEY MIGHT WORK TILL MIDNIGHT MONDAY AND TUESDAY NIGHT. WELL, GOING INTO THIS NEXT YEAR, IF THEY HAVE 48, IF THEY HAVE 40 HOURS IN AND THEY'RE DONE ON WEDNESDAY WITH 40 HOURS, PETER'S NOT GOING TO HAVE THEM COME BACK TO WORK FOR THE REST OF THE WEEK. THEY'RE JUST GOING TO STOP WHEN THAT PIPES FIXED ON TUESDAY NIGHT AND NOT WORK THURSDAY AND FRIDAY AND WHATEVER THEY WERE GOING TO BE WORKING ON, THEY'LL PICK UP NEXT WEEK WHEN THEY GET BACK SO THAT BECAUSE THEY'RE ALREADY AT 40, 40 HOURS. SO THOSE THURSDAY AND FRIDAY WOULD BE A TIME AND A HALF, WHEREAS IF THEY JUST WAIT TILL THE NEXT WEEK AND DO IT LESS THAN THAT, THE ONLY PROBLEM IS THAT'S ABOUT $40,000 IS WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE. 
          IT'LL SAVE. SO IT'S NOT HUGE NUMBERS. THE POLICE AND FIRE IS A HARDER. BEAST TO TACKLE IT BECAUSE OF THE WAY THE, THE SCHEDULING GOES. AND SO WE ARE TAKING THAT OVERTIME INTO CONSIDERATION THOUGH. AND I AGREE WITH YOUR OBSERVATION THAT IT'S A IT'S A HUGE NUMBER. AND IT YOU KNOW, IT'S KIND OF MISLEADING BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T INCLUDE IT, IT'S YOU KNOW, WHAT PEOPLE ARE BEING PAID. WHAT THEY'RE EARNING IS, IS OFF BY $1 MILLION. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? I JUST I THINK OVER TIME SUPER HIGH. PERSONALLY MY OPINION I KNOW THERE WAS DISCUSSION TO MIKE. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S EVER BEEN MENTIONED TO YOU AS WELL. THE MSD, I GUESS WITH THE CONTRACT WITH SCHOOLS POINT BEING LOW, I DON'T KNOW. IT'S A CONTRACT FOR A CONTRACT UNTIL 2828. WHAT WOULD IT BE IF IT WAS THE SAME AS MARTIN COUNTY? MSTU RATE LIKE IF WE MATCHED IT, I, I HAVE NO IDEA, I HAVEN'T. WELL, FIRST OF ALL, IF THE MARTIN COUNTY'S RATE IS 2.67 RIGHT NOW. 
          SO IF YOU TOOK THE VALUATION OF $950 MILLION, WHICH IS WHAT SEWALL'S POINT'S MOST RECENT VALUATION IS, SO 950 TO DO TO DO TIMES, I'M SORRY, 950. BASICALLY TIMES .00267 EQUALS IT'D BE $2,536,500. I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY IT'S DEFINITELY OVER 2 MILLION THAT THEY WOULD PAY IF THEY WERE IF THEY WERE PARTICIPATING IN MARTIN COUNTY'S MSTU, THEIR THEIR FIRE BILL WOULD BE OVER 2 MILLION. IT'S TWO 536 BASED UPON THEIR CURRENT ASSESSMENT. HOWEVER, I DON'T KNOW WHAT EXEMPTIONS THEY HAVE AND WHAT, YOU KNOW, DIFFERENT HOMESTEAD STUFF. NOW, FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER THAT WHEN IT WAS ENTERED IN ESSENTIALLY 2017, THE VALUATIONS WERE CONSIDERABLY DIFFERENT AND THE RATES WERE DIFFERENT, BUT EVEN THEN THE NUMBER COULD HAVE BEEN HIGHER. YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL WITH THAT THOUGH, BECAUSE WE'VE NOW WHEN WE DID IT, THE CITY ADOPTED THAT PROGRAM BECAUSE IT HAD THE CAPACITY TO PROVIDE THE SERVICE WITHOUT HAVING TO HIRE ADDITIONAL PEOPLE. BUT WE'VE NOW BECOME, YOU KNOW, THAT'S PART OF OUR BUDGET. IF AND I THINK IT'S ABOUT 900,000 NOW THAT THEY'RE PAYING, I DON'T THINK 800 THIS 
          [01:05:03]
YEAR. NO. THE ACCORDING TO THE CONTRACT, WE'RE AT SEVEN. OKAY. SO 700,000. IT WENT FROM THREE. 
          THERE WAS A JUMP FROM 3 TO 5 AND NOW A JUMP AGAIN FROM 5 TO 7. WE'VE HAD TWO VERY AGGRESSIVE JUMPS. AND THERE WAS I HAD PUT TOGETHER TWO PROPOSALS THAT I THOUGHT WERE A DIFFERENT WAY TO EQUITABLY DETERMINE IT BACK THEN, BUT IT WAS CHOSEN TO BE AT FIVE AND THEN WE'RE AT SEVEN. 
          WELL, IF WE SAID TO SEWELL'S POINT, IT'S GOING TO BE 2.5 MILLION. SEWELL'S POINT MIGHT SAY, OKAY, WELL, WE'RE JUST GOING TO GO WITH THE COUNTY. AND THEN WE WOULD HAVE A $700,000 HOLE IN THE FIRE DEPARTMENT BECAUSE WE WOULDN'T BE ABLE A THIRD THAT I MEAN. WELL, YEAH, WITHOUT A DOUBT THAT THE NUMBER SHOULD BE READDRESSED. BUT WHEN THE COMMISSION ENTERED INTO THAT CONTRACT, IT WAS A TEN YEAR SERVICE OR AGREEMENT WITH SEWELL'S POINT SO THAT EQUIPMENT COULD BE PURCHASED AND THINGS LIKE THAT. AND THE WAY IT WAS NEGOTIATED WITH THE CITY MANAGER AT THE TIME WAS THE WAY IT READS. AND SO IF WE WERE TO CANCEL IT, WE, UNDER THE AGREEMENT, HAVE TO PAY THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT THEY PAY US RIGHT NOW AND WHAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO PAY MARTIN COUNTY. SO WE WOULD HAVE TO PAY SEWELL'S POINT. THAT WOULDN'T MAKE SENSE. 
          YEAH. SO WE CAN'T DO THAT NOW. I HAVE HAD CONVERSATIONS BOTH WITH OUR CHIEF AS WELL AS WITH THE SEWELL'S POINT CITY MANAGER, PROBABLY, YOU KNOW, HAVING THEM IN PUBLIC COMMENTS HERE AS TO WHAT THE AMOUNTS ARE. BUT YEAH, AS TO INCENTIVES TO ENTER INTO AN AGREEMENT EARLY. SO IF WE WERE TO TRY TO WORK OUT A DEAL WITH SEWELL'S POINT TO ENTER INTO AN AGREEMENT EARLY, THAT WOULD BE IN 26 OR EVEN 27, WE'D HAVE TO GIVE THEM ENOUGH OF AN INCENTIVE TO AGREE TO PAY SIGNIFICANTLY MORE THAN THEY'RE PAYING NOW, BUT SIGNIFICANTLY LESS THAN THE 2.5 THEY WOULD AGREE. THAT WOULD MAKE THEM WANT TO AGREE TO DO A NEW DEAL EARLY. AND OBVIOUSLY, IT WOULD HAVE TO BE ENOUGH TO MAKE THE CITY OF STUART INTERESTED ENOUGH TO MAKE IT GO UP. THE PROBLEM IS THAT WHEN WE LOOK AT THE SEWELL'S POINT CONTRACT, WE LOOK AT IT AS A SERVICE AND A READINESS AND A WE PROVIDE YOU WITH THIS FIRE SERVICE, NOT FOR THE CALLS YOU ACTUALLY RECEIVE, BUT FOR THE ABILITY TO FOR US TO RESPOND TO A CALL IN THE EVENT YOU NEED IT. BECAUSE LAST MONTH THEY HAD 30 CALLS. SO IF IT'S 30 CALLS TIMES 12 MONTHS, IF IT'S A TOTAL OF 360 CALLS AND YOU'RE CHARGING 2.5 MILLION, THEY WOULD SAY, WELL, WAIT A SECOND, YOU'RE CHARGING US, YOU KNOW, $100,000 A CALL OR WHATEVER IT IS. AND BUT IT'S NOT THAT. IT'S NOT THE NUMBER OF CALLS, IT'S THE READINESS. IT'S THE SECURITY THAT WE'RE THERE IN THE EVENT THE CALL NEEDS TO HAPPEN. SO THE WAY WE LOOK AT IT AND DISCUSS IT IS EVERYBODY, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE IN SEWELL'S POINT, YOU TAKE THE APPROACH THAT IT SHOULD BE LIKE A LA CARTE WILL ONLY PAY WHEN WE CALL. AND OF COURSE, WE CAN'T PROVIDE A SERVICE LIKE THAT BECAUSE IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE FOR US. MR. MANAGER, AN ANALOGY THAT WE'VE USED INTERNALLY IS IT'S LIKE YOUR WATER SERVICE. IF WE MADE WATER ON DEMAND ONLY, YOU'D TURN ON YOUR FAUCET AND THEN WAIT 20 MINUTES FOR THE WATER TO GET THERE BECAUSE THEY KNEW THAT YOU WERE ASKING FOR IT. VERSUS THE READINESS IS THE WATER'S ALWAYS THERE AT THE TAP, RIGHT? IF YOU TURN ON THE FAUCET, THE WATER'S THERE. THAT'S OUR BASE FEE AND THAT'S OUR READINESS CHARGE. AFTER THAT, WE CHARGE YOU FOR CONSUMPTION HOW MANY GALLONS YOU USE. SO THE FACT THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO ONLY BILL ME IF I USE IT, WELL, THEN WE CAN'T BE ON STANDBY CONSTANTLY TO SEND THEM THE TRUCK WHEN THEY ASK FOR IT. SO. ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS I WAS GOING TO, MR. COMMISSIONER. WELL, NOW MY QUESTIONS ARE MORE BECAUSE I KNOW EVERYBODY'S GOING TO REMEMBER. FIRST I WANT TO SAY THAT I AGREE THE OVERTIME SOUNDS REALLY HIGH, BUT THE REALITY IS IF WE HAD TO HIRE MORE PEOPLE WITH INSURANCE, BENEFITS, SALARY, ALL OF THAT WOULD BE PROBABLY MORE THAN THAT IF WE WERE TRYING TO FILL THOSE POSITIONS TO HAVE THEM READY AVAILABLE RATHER THAN PULLING FOR OVERTIME, WE INCREASE THE FIRE DEPARTMENT'S BUDGET BY $1.1 MILLION BY IN HIRING LAST YEAR, AND WE STILL HAD OVER HALF $1 MILLION IN OVERTIME. RIGHT. AND YOU WOULD PROBABLY HAVE MORE IF YOU DID NOT HIRE THOSE. EXACTLY. 
          IT WOULD BE SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER. AND THAT'S WHAT WE DID. WE ACTUALLY BOUGHT WE HIRED THREE WHAT I CALL FLOATERS LAST YEAR. AND THE FLOATERS WERE WE HAVE A, B AND C SHIFT. SO WE HIRED POSITIONS THAT COULD GO TO STATION ONE, 2 OR 3 ON A, B AND C SHIFT. SO IF SOMEONE'S OUT AT 
          [01:10:01]
STATION TWO, ONE OF THE FLOATERS CAN WORK THAT STATION TWO POSITION TO AVOID THE OVERTIME OR WHEREVER IT NEEDS TO BE. UNFORTUNATELY, WITH FMLA OR COMP AND OUR PTO AND MILITARY LEAVE AND OTHER ISSUES, THERE WERE MORE PEOPLE OUT THAN WE HAD TO REPLACE THEM WITH. BUT THAT'S NOT YOUR NORMAL ONGOING. I MEAN, THAT JUST HAPPENED TO BE JUST ONE OF THOSE YEARS. FIRESTORM IN ONE YEAR. THE SECOND IS THAT AT SOME POINT, MAYBE YOU AND I CAN TALK BECAUSE THERE MAYBE THERE ARE OTHER WAYS WE CAN INCREASE REVENUE. JUST I'M NOT GOING TO GO THROUGH THEM NOW AND GET NITPICKING INTO THEM. THE OTHER THING IS I JUST WANTED TO COMMENT ON COMMISSIONER CLARK ALMOST MADE IT APPEAR THAT IF WE STAYED AT FIVE, THERE WOULD BE NO LOSS OF POSITIONS, AND I'M ASSUMING MOST OF THOSE WOULD BE ATTRITION. WE'RE NOT FILLING A POSITION WHERE SOMEONE LEAVES OR FIRE, SO IT ISN'T JUST A 4.75. IT IS. EVEN IF WE LEFT IT AT FIVE, THERE WOULD BE REDUCTIONS. 
          AND THEN GOING TO THE POINT OF THE VICE MAYOR, WE NEED TO SLOWLY PULL BACK ON THAT THROTTLE. OTHERWISE WE'RE GOING TO BE IN A SITUATION IN A YEAR OR TWO WHERE WE HAVE TO HIT THE BRAKES AT THE STOP, AND WE'RE GOING TO BE MAYBE HAVING TO REALLY SLASH. I MEAN, IT'S MUCH BETTER TO DO IT ON A SLOWER BASE GOING FORWARD AND CONTROL IT, WHICH IS WHAT WE CAN DO NOW RATHER THAN HAVE TO REACT TO IT WHEN ALL OF A SUDDEN WE'RE HIT WITH, YOU KNOW, CATASTROPHES AND WHATEVER WAY, SHAPE OR FORM, YOU KNOW, PROPERTY TAX ALL OF A SUDDEN BEING PULLED ALL OF THE THINGS THAT BRING US REVENUE NOW. SO IF WE WANT TO, LET'S CONTROL IT WITH OUR ABILITY TO DO IT NOW, DO IT SLOWLY BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, AGAIN WITH SLOW GROWTH, IT'S DO IT SLOWLY, DO IT SMARTLY. DON'T WAIT TILL IT'S SMACKING US IN THE FACE. AND THEN WE ALL HAVE TO DO, YOU KNOW, KIND OF FIRE, FOR LACK OF A BETTER ANALOGY, YOU'RE OUT OF FIRE AND NOW YOU HAVE TO HIT ALL FORCES GOING FORWARD. SO THAT'S ALL I HAD TO SAY. THANK YOU. BUT I'D LIKE TO HEAR ON THE VARIOUS. 
          WELL, YEAH, THAT'S THAT'S WHERE WE LEFT OFF. SHE'S TALKING TO COMMISSIONER. OH. JUST BECAUSE IT GETS ME, IT GETS US ALL THINKING THAT I GUESS. RIGHT. I MEAN, AND EXCUSE MY IGNORANCE BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW, YOU SAY THAT WE GIVE ANNUALLY MONEY TO THE CRA. IS THAT A MANDATORY AMOUNT? WE HAVE TO BE HERE. OKAY, SO BACK TO THE COUNTY. CORRECT. WELL OKAY. SO RIGHT. SO WE ACTUALLY WORKED THE SAME AMOUNT THAT THE COUNTY HAS TO PAY US FROM THEIR AD VALOREM. 
          OKAY. WE HAVE TO PAY THE CRA FROM OUR AD VALOREM. ALL RIGHT. AND I KNOW THIS IS JUST ALWAYS A HOT TOPIC. IT'S THAT IMPACT FEES AND LOTS OF COUNTIES ARE DOING THEM. THEY'RE INCREASING THEM. 
          NUMBER ONE, I HAVE AN ISSUE WITH IMPACT FEES. THEY COME IN AT A CERTAIN RATE AND THE PROJECT DOESN'T GET DONE UNTIL THREE, 2 OR 3 YEARS LATER WHEN THOSE IMPACT FEES ARE REALLY MORE SO. 
          MAYBE A WAY THAT WE CHARGE THOSE IMPACT FEES SO THAT THEY COVER THE ACTUAL COST OF IMPROVEMENT FOR INFRASTRUCTURE WHEN THAT PROJECT IS DONE, MIGHT BE A BETTER WAY TO HANDLE IT, RATHER THAN TAKING IN THE MONEY AND THEN WAITING TILL THE PROJECT STARTS. AND WE REALLY ARE ALREADY SHORT IN DOING THE INFRASTRUCTURE AROUND THAT PROJECT. SO THAT WAS ONE OTHER THING, AND THE LAST ONE I MENTIONED WAS, I'M SURE YOU'RE NOT JUST LOOKING AT POSITIONS TO SLASH ITS THOSE. I'M ASSUMING A LOT OF THEM WOULD BE PEOPLE WHO ARE LEAVING OR RETIRING, AND YOU'RE JUST NOT FILLING THAT POSITION. I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW, I'M JUST I'M ASKING THE QUESTION, IS THAT HOW YOU'RE DEALING WITH SOME OF THE REDUCTION IN ALL OF THE REDUCTIONS THAT WERE WOULD BE BASED BY ATTRITION OR FILLING LIKE THAT HAVE ALREADY HAPPENED. 
          SO ANY ADDITIONAL WOULD NOT BE ATTRITION. OKAY. SO THAT THEY WOULD ACTUALLY WE'VE HAD I'VE HAD TWO SINCE THE FIRST BUDGET WORKSHOP THAT WERE THAT ENDED UP HAVING SEPARATION FROM THE CITY, THAT UPON SEPARATION I TERMINATED THAT POSITION JUST BECAUSE IT WAS FLUID. SO THOSE TWO ARE ALREADY GONE. AND THEN THERE'S ABOUT SIX MORE THAT. THERE WERE NINE POSITIONS THAT WERE OPEN THAT I, THAT I FROZE TO HIRING. SIX OF THOSE HAVE BEEN COMPLETELY ELIMINATED. AND NOW THERE'S A, THERE'S I THINK THREE POSITIONS STILL OPEN THAT WOULD POTENTIALLY BE OPEN TO HIRING. AND THEN THERE'S ALSO SOME OTHER POSITIONS THAT AGAIN, WE I'M USING A GARBAGE TRUCK DRIVER. WE DO HAVE POSITIONS OR I THINK IT WAS A DIESEL MECHANIC FOR EXAMPLE. DIESEL MECHANIC LEFT THAT POSITION CAME OPEN. BUT WE HAVE TO REPLACE THE DIESEL MECHANIC. SO I AUTHORIZED MILTON TO HIRE THAT PERSON. AND A NEW PERSON IS COMING INTO THAT POSITION BECAUSE IT'S JUST SIMPLY, YOU KNOW, NOT ONE THAT WAS THAT WAS PLAUSIBLE FOR US TO GET RID OF. AND TO THE MANAGER'S POINT, WHEN HE AUTHORIZED THAT REHIRE COMMISSIONER, I THEN FUNDED THAT POSITION BACK SO THAT THAT POSITION IS FUNDED BECAUSE WE ARE, IN FACT, GOING TO FILL IT. AND I PRESUME THAT PERSON WILL BE WORKING HERE NEXT YEAR. SO THAT WAS SO THAT WAS A CUT THAT HAD TO GO BACK AND 
          [01:15:02]
AGAIN, NOT LOOKING AT DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS. BUT I KNOW NOTHING ABOUT TRUCKS, DIESELS OR WHATEVER. BUT ARE SOME OF THESE POSITIONS SOMETHING THAT WE MIGHT IT MIGHT BE MORE BENEFICIAL FOR US TO CONTRACT OUT? I DON'T KNOW HOW OFTEN A DIESEL PERSON IS NEEDED, BUT MAYBE IT IS SOMETHING IN THE. SO THEY'RE NOT PAYING BENEFITS, YOU'RE NOT PAYING INSURANCE, YOU'RE NOT PAYING A SALARY, YOU'RE JUST CONTRACTING OUT TO AN INDIVIDUAL OR A COMPANY THAT WOULD COME IN AND DO THAT NEED FOR THAT PERIOD. WE SPEND A LITTLE OVER $500,000 A YEAR RIGHT NOW CONTRACTING OUT FOR SERVICES OF THOSE NATURE. AND JOLIE AND I ACTUALLY TALKED ABOUT AN HOUR AND A HALF THIS MORNING ABOUT SOME OTHER POTENTIAL POSITIONS. BUT LIKE YOU SAID, THERE'S A THERE'S A FINE LINE THERE. YES. YOU GET RID OF THAT EMPLOYEE AND THEN YOU END UP CONTRACTING OUT AND IT TURNS OUT COSTING MORE, AND THEN YOU END UP WELL. BUT THAT'S THE ANALYSIS THAT GETS DONE PRIOR TO THAT. AND THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. WE'RE LIKE WE FEEL LIKE WE'RE PRETTY CLOSE TO THAT NOW. I'M SORRY. BEFORE MAYOR, BEFORE YOU ANSWER COMMISSIONER REED'S QUESTION, COMMISSIONER. YEAH, WE DON'T BUDGET IMPACT FEES SO THAT THAT'S NOT SOMETHING WE BUDGET. SO WE DON'T SAY, OH, WE EXPECT TO COLLECT IMPACT FEES THIS YEAR. BUT IF I HAVE AN APPLICABLE PROJECT, WHICH SHOULD BE, BY THE DEFINITION, THE IMPACT FEES BE AN EXPANSION IN SERVICE. SO IF THEY WERE GOING TO BUILD A FOURTH FIRE STATION, LIKE, HEY, WE'RE EXPANDING SERVICE, I CAN USE IMPACT FEES THAT WE COLLECTED TO FUND THAT PROJECT, BUT I CAN'T USE IMPACT FEES TO FUND THE SALARIES OR ANYTHING. SO IF I. YES, MA'AM. SO WELL, I'M TALKING ABOUT THE INFRASTRUCTURE TO YOUR TO YOUR POINT, IF I HAD THE PROJECT, I'D LOVE IT. IF THIS EXPENSE WAS PROJECTS, I'D BE LIKE, OH, WELL, LET ME PULL AN IMPACT FEES AND FUND IT. BUT I DO AGREE WITH YOU THAT IT'S GROSSLY UNDERFUNDED BECAUSE IT'S LIKE SOCIAL SECURITY, RIGHT? THEY COLLECT THE MONEY WHEN YOU'RE 20 AND THEN, YOU KNOW, 70 YEARS LATER, THEY WANT TO PAY YOU THE MONEY. THEY COLLECTED THAT RATE WHEN YOU'RE 20. SO IT'S LIKE, YEAH, THE IMPACT FEE SHOULD BE 20 YEARS FROM NOW, WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST TO REPLACE IT, NOT WHAT IT WAS TODAY. WE DID WE ALSO YOU CAN'T YOU CAN'T USE IMPACT FEES FOR REPLACEMENT OR MAINTENANCE. 
          YOU HAVE TO BE NEW TO INCREASE CAPACITY. SO IF WE TOOK A ROAD IMPACT FEE WE CAN'T PAY IT JUST TO REPAVE THE ROAD. WE ACTUALLY HAVE TO BUILD NEW ROAD MILES. SO A FEW YEARS AGO WE HAD AN IMPACT FEE STUDY DONE AND WE HAD TO REDUCE OUR ROAD IMPACT FEES BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE ANY ROADS PLANNED TO BE BUILT. SO THERE WAS NO ROAD MILES. NOW A TURNING LANE CAN INCREASE CAPACITY OR WIDENING OF A ROAD CAN INCREASE CAPACITY. BUT A TRAFFIC LIGHT? WE'VE PAID FOR TRAFFIC LIGHTS, SO WE HAVE THOSE. BUT WE'VE HAD TO INCREASE ROADS, NEW TURN LANES, PUT IN EXTRA LIGHTS. SO AGAIN, I DON'T THINK THE IMPACT FEES WE CHARGE COVERED ENOUGH. AND THE PROBLEM IS IT'S ALSO IF YOU LOOK BACK AT IT, YOU CAN ONLY CHARGE WHAT THE IMPACT IS BY THAT DEVELOPER. WE A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF OUR TRAFFIC COMES FROM OUR NEIGHBORS TO THE NORTH AND SOUTH, AND THEY DON'T BUILD IN STUART. AND SO IF SOMEBODY BUILT A BUILDING IN JENSEN BEACH AND THEY DRIVE INTO STUART EVERY DAY, THOSE IMPACT FEES STAY IN JENSEN BEACH. YES. NO. WELL THE PART OF JENSEN BEACH THAT DOESN'T. RIGHT. AND I AND THAT'S THE CALCULATION BUT PRESCRIBED BY THE STATE. RIGHT. 
          SO WE DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO JUST WALK UP. WELL ACTUALLY SEVERAL COMMISSIONERS ACROSS THE STATE OF FLORIDA HAVE INCREASED THEIR IMPACT. SO AND ACCORDING TO THE FORMULA. BUT LIKE MANATEE COUNTY THAT'S THEY'RE IN THE PROCESS NOW THAT'S PART OF THEIR SB 180 CHALLENGE. YES. SO WE'D HAVE TO PILE THAT INTO THAT. OKAY. DOUBLING THEIR. YEAH I THINK IT'S A DOUBLE. YEAH I JUST I JUST I JUST WANTED TO STATE LIKE THIS IS A PRIME EXAMPLE. GROWTH DOESN'T PAY FOR ITSELF. 
          NO I CAN TELL YOU THAT. AMEN. YOU KNOW, WE LOOK AT OUR AD VALOREM TAXES AND THIS ISN'T A JAB AT FIRE RESCUE OR POLICE, BUT IT EATS UP OUR ENTIRE AD VALOREM FOR THE PROPERTY VALUES. 
          DEFINITELY AREN'T THERE. EVEN SUSTAIN WHAT WE HAVE IN THE CITY AS FAR AS VILLAGE DECREASES? I MEAN, LIKE MIKE SAID, IT DOES GO MORE TOWARDS COMMERCIAL. I KNOW ON THE RESIDENTIAL SIDE FOR WHAT I PAY IN PROPERTY TAXES. I DO NOT UTILIZE THOSE SERVICES IN THE CITY. SO I'M ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE THAT CONTRIBUTE TO THE NEXT HOUSEHOLD THAT'S GOING TO PICK UP THAT PHONE AND CALL 911 OR WHATEVER SERVICES THEY HAVE. I DON'T HAVE CHILDREN THAT ARE IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS, BUT I BELIEVE IN THE NEXT GENERATION, SO I AM CONTRIBUTING. BUT HOW DO YOU GET OTHER PEOPLE TO PAY THEIR FAIR SHARE? BECAUSE EVERYBODY WANTS, BUT NOBODY WANTS TO PAY IT OUT OF THEIR OWN POCKET. INSTEAD THEY WANT IT COMING OUT OF SOMEONE ELSE'S POCKET. I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD TARGET EVENTS THAT WE HAVE IN THE CITY AND STUFF LIKE THAT, BECAUSE THAT'S ACTUALLY A REVENUE GENERATOR. 
          WHEN WE HAVE ROCK AND RIVERWALK, ANY KIND OF MUSIC AND MOVEMENT PARADES THAT GENERATES. YEAH. 
          [01:20:05]
LIKE THAT, THAT STUFF I WOULDN'T GO AFTER. IT'S MORE SO LIKE, I MEAN, YEAH, THE OVERTIME, IT IS ANNOYING, BUT THE AD VALOREM, THE PROPERTY VALUES THEMSELVES BASICALLY DO NOT SUSTAIN THE GROWTH THAT WE EVEN HAVE IN OUR OWN CITY. SO WHAT DO YOU DO LONG TERM WHEN YOU SAY THE GROWTH WE HAVE IN OUR CITY, OUR CITY ACTUALLY WENT DOWN 690 PEOPLE. OUR POPULATION WAS REDUCED FOR THE FIRST TIME. SO AND I KNOW YOU MENTIONED, MIKE, SOMETHING WITH COMMERCIAL MULTIFAMILY. 
          THEY EQUATE TO THE LOWEST 2000 RESIDENCES. HOW MANY MULTIFAMILY UNITS WERE THEY? I DON'T WELL, IT'S SO IF WE SAY IT'S HARD TO I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY UNITS IT IS. BUT FOR EXAMPLE, THE TOP TEN IMPACT THE TOP TEN TAXPAYERS IN STUART WERE MULTI ARE INDIGO AND WHATEVER IT IS NORTH OF THE BRIDGE. AND SO THEY'RE THEY GENERATE OVER OR RIGHT AT $2 MILLION OF THE $18 MILLION. JUST THOSE TEN IN TAXES. AND THE BOTTOM 2000 DON'T GENERATE $2 MILLION. I WAS JUST CURIOUS FROM MY THOSE APARTMENTS EAT UP MOST OF THE SERVICE. WHY WHY? I DON'T KNOW THAT I STAND ALONE HOME WITH THE FAMILY VERSUS AN APARTMENT WITH 200 PEOPLE. THEY'RE GOING TO USE SERVICES MORE THAN WHAT WE'VE. WHAT WE FOUND IS THAT THE ASSISTED LIVING FACILITIES AND THE 55 AND OLDER ARE THE HIGHEST SERVICE USERS, AND THAT'S JUST BY THE VERY NATURE OF THE THING. WE FOUND THAT ACCESS AND INDIGO HAVE NO MORE CALLS THAN ANY OTHER NEIGHBORHOOD IS THEY'RE NEWER. IT'S JUST THE, THE, THE PEOPLE LIVING THERE MIGHT BE 30. AND SO THEY JUST DON'T HAVE THE, THE CALLS THAT YOU WOULD HAVE. WALMART HAS A LOT OF CALLS. THEY'RE NOT SIGNIFICANT. BUT IT'S PETTY THEFT AND STUFF LIKE THAT. BUT THEY BUILT THEY BUILT A SUBSTATION AT THE STORE FOR THE POLICE TO USE. BUT JUST BY ITS VERY NATURE, ALSO, I THINK THE FIREFIGHTERS THAT ARE HERE PROBABLY TELL YOU THEY GO TO WALMART AND STUFF LIKE THAT OFTEN AS WELL, JUST BECAUSE PEOPLE HAVE ISSUES WHEN THEY'RE WHEREVER THEY HAVE A LARGE GROUP OF PEOPLE, YOU HAVE ISSUES. BUT THE DO YOU HAVE THAT CHART? JULIE? I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN ACCESS IT. I DON'T KNOW IF IT MATTERS OR NOT, BUT HE HAS A CHART THAT HAS THE THINGS ON IT. LIKE I SAID, THERE WAS A TIME CRUNCH. I HAD TO I HAD TO COME UP WITH WHAT WAS THE MOST ECONOMICAL. BUT AND IT ALSO IT WE ALSO CAN'T AND DON'T CAN'T DETERMINE THE WHO USES THE MOST SERVICES LIKE YOU KNOW, THE DOES THE PERSON IN THIS SINGLE FAMILY HOME OVER IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD USE MORE SERVICES THAN I DO, SO THEY SHOULD PAY HIGHER TAXES THAN I DO. AND YOU JUST CAN'T GO DOWN THAT PATH. NO, THAT WAS BECAUSE. 
          RIGHT. IT'S LIKE THE WELL, COMMISSIONER, SERVICE COMMUNITY COMMISSIONER JOB TO TIE IT BACK TO YOUR EARLIER IMPACT FEE DISCUSSION, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU'RE CALCULATING TO THE FORMULA OF THE MAYOR WAS TALKING ABOUT TRANSPORTATION IMPACT FEES ARE USUALLY CALCULATED BASED ON WHAT'S CALLED TRIP GENERATION. AND THEY SAY, WELL, A CPA OFFICE ISN'T GOING TO GENERATE MANY TRIPS. SO IF YOU'RE BUILDING A CPA OFFICE, IT'S A VERY LOW IMPACT FEE. BUT THEY'LL SAY LIKE A BAR IS GOING TO GENERATE A LOT OF TRIPS. WELL, ASSISTED LIVING FACILITIES ARE ONE OF THE HIGHEST TRIP GENERATORS, SO THEY PAY A LARGER TRANSPORTATION IMPACT FEE WHEN THEY'RE GOING TO BUILD THAT. SO THEY LOOK AT THE STATISTICS AND SCIENCE. THEY SAY, HOW OFTEN ARE PEOPLE, HOW OFTEN IS EMS BEING CALLED THERE? HOW OFTEN IS PUBLIC SAFETY BEING CALLED THERE? HOW OFTEN IS WHATEVER HAPPENING THERE ACCIDENTS. AND SO YOU CAN LOOK AT THOSE TRIP GENERATIONS AND BASICALLY TIE THAT INTO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS A DEMAND FOR SERVICE, BECAUSE THEY'RE SAYING THIS IS HOW MANY CARS ARE GOING TO GO IN AND OUT, RIGHT? A CAR DEALERSHIP HAS A LARGE NUMBER OF TRIP GENERATIONS BECAUSE PEOPLE JUMP FROM CAR DEALERSHIP TO CAR DEALERSHIP, SHOPPING FOR CARS IN ONE DAY. THAT'S WHY THE TRANSPORTATION IMPACT FEE IS SO HIGH ON A CAR DEALERSHIP VERSUS LIKE A CONSIGNMENT SHOP IS NOTHING, RIGHT? YOU'RE GOING TO PULL UP, PARK, SHOP FOR AN HOUR AND THEN LEAVE. AND THAT'S THAT'S ONE TRIP VERSUS THE OTHERS. SO THIS CHART THAT I PULLED UP, I KNOW. ARE YOU DONE? YEAH. I'M JUST I'M LISTENING. OH. OKAY. BOSS, THE MANAGER HAD ASKED ME TO BREAK THIS OUT IN A PARTICULAR WAY, I DID. I DID NOT HAVE TIME TODAY TO BREAK IT OUT THAT WAY. BUT THERE'S A DIRECT CORRELATION HERE. SO THIS GRAPH LOOKS VERY SIMILAR TO THE GRAPH I USUALLY SHOW EACH YEAR IN THE BREAKDOWN OF THE PROPERTIES. AND WHAT THIS IS, IS TO THE MANAGER'S POINT, HE WAS SAYING THAT THERE WERE TEN. THERE'S ACTUALLY 71 PARCELS CURRENTLY IN THE DATABASE AT THE PROPERTY APPRAISER TAGGED AS MULTIFAMILY UNITS GREATER THAN TEN. NOW THAT 
          [01:25:01]
GREATER THAN TEN COULD BE 11 OR IT COULD BE 300, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER THE UNITS ARE. AND SO THIS GRAPH USUALLY SHOWS YOU HOW MUCH WE'RE COLLECTING IN TAXES FROM THESE GROUPS. THIS TODAY. 
          AND I AGAIN, I HAVEN'T HAD TIME TO LABEL IT CORRECTLY. BUT THIS IS WHERE THE QUARTER MILL IS. 
          THEIR PORTION OF THE QUARTER MILL. SO AND I KNOW COMMISSIONER COLLINS, YOU SAID IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER WHERE IT GOES IF IT'S RESIDENTIAL OR COMMERCIAL, BUT PASSING ON THAT QUARTER MILL SAVINGS, THIS IS HOW THAT QUARTER MILL SAVINGS GETS DISTRIBUTED TO THOSE PROPERTY TYPES. SO AND THIS IS RESIDENTIAL ONLY. AND SO THESE DOWN HERE ON THIS END ARE THOSE INCLUDED IN THIS ARE THOSE 71 MULTIFAMILY UNITS. SO THAT THE BLUE LINE WHERE HIS THE BLUE LINE IS THE NUMBER OF PARCELS OF THAT TYPE. OKAY. RIGHT. AND THEN THE GREEN IS HOW MUCH OF THE QUARTER MILL SAVINGS GOES TO THAT GROUP. OKAY. AND I BROKE IT DOWN A LITTLE MORE. I KNOW THAT WE'VE MENTIONED THESE PEOPLE A COUPLE TIMES, AND THIS IS A STANDARD DISPLAY THAT WE DO EVERY YEAR BASED ON WHAT THE AVERAGE BILL WOULD BE. AND SO IN PICKING UP. SO. THIS IS WHAT THE EFFECT OF THIS IS THE TAXABLE VALUE OF THOSE MULTIFAMILY UNITS. AND THIS HERE'S MY PROBLEM. YES SIR. WE'RE IN A BUDGET MEETING. RIGHT. WHY ARE WE NOT LOOKING AT WHAT WAS SPENT LAST YEAR AND WHERE VERSUS WHAT IS PROPOSED FOR THIS YEAR, AND EVEN MAYBE PREVIOUS DATA? WHY ARE WE LOOKING AT MULTIFAMILY AS BEING THE GENERATOR OF INCOME? WHY ARE WE PUTTING SO MUCH ENERGY INTO THIS? WE'RE NOT ACTUALLY, WE DIDN'T PICK MULTIFAMILY. WHAT WE DID IS LOOKED AT THE REVENUESOMING FRO. AND IT TURNS OUT IF YOU GO BACK TO THE GRAPH, THAT THAT MULTIFAMILY WAS JUST BUDGET, THAT'S WHO IT WAS. THE BUDGET MEETING IS FIGURING OUT OUR BUDGET, NOT NOT TRYING TO FIGURE OUT AND DOUBLE DOWN ON THIS TALKING POINT OF THIS ARGUMENT OF LIKE OF RESIDENTIAL HOMES VERSUS MULTIFAMILY. WHAT'S OUR BUDGET? THE CONVERSATION IS NOT NEW THIS YEAR. THE PURPOSE BEHIND IT IS ALSO BECAUSE THE RESIDENTS GET THE SERVICES. 
          THEY'RE THE ONES THAT ACTUALLY WANT THE BOARDWALK. THEY'RE THE ONES THAT WANT THE PARKS, WANT THE GARBAGE PICKUP, WANT WANT THE SERVICES. THEY'RE THE ONES THAT REALLY MAKE UP THE COMMUNITY. THE CORPORATIONS DON'T USE. BUT THAT IS NOT THE PURPOSE OF OUR BUDGET MEETING. 
          THE BUDGET MEETING IS TO BALANCE WHAT THE RESIDENTS WANT. OUR BUDGET. RIGHT? RIGHT. SO WHY ARE WE PUTTING SO MUCH ENERGY INTO THIS NARRATIVE OF MULTIFAMILY AND COMMERCIAL GETTING IN AND OUT OF A 2.0.25 DECREASE VERSUS HOMEOWNERS? IT JUST FEELS LIKE WE'RE REALLY BEATING THIS BECAUSE GOING INTO THIS REDUCED THE AMOUNT THAT THE HOMEOWNERS ARE AFFECTED, MATTERS SO THAT THEY CAN DECIDE WHETHER THEY'RE GETTING A GOOD VALUE FOR WHAT THE PAYMENT THEY'RE MAKING IS. 
          BUT OUR JOB IS TO FIGURE OUT THE BUDGET, NOT THAT. COMMISSIONER COLLINS. I'M SORRY. YOU YOU'RE LOOKING RIGHT AT ME, SO I'LL TALK DIRECTLY TO YOU. SURE. I PROVIDE THIS SCHEDULE EVERY YEAR WITH EVERY BUDGET WORKSHOP. WE SAY, WHAT THE. IF IT WAS STILL FIVE, I'D STILL HAVE A DISPLAY OF WHAT THE AVERAGE TAXPAYER OF VARIOUS RATES. I'VE INCLUDED IT EVERY YEAR. YOU CAN LOOK WITH THE CITY CLERK THROUGH THE PUBLIC RECORDS. EVERY YEAR WE INCLUDE WHAT AN AVERAGE TAXPAYER'S BILL WOULD LOOK LIKE. I PUT A FEW DIFFERENT NUMBERS OF SOMEONE WITH $100,000 VALUE HOUSE, SOMEONE WITH A $200,000 HOUSE, SOMEONE WITH A 50. SOMEBODY WITH NOTHING. WE SHOW THAT EVERY YEAR. THIS WAS ACTUALLY LOOKING AT THE SAVINGS AND WHERE IT'S GOING. IF WE IF WE'RE REDUCING THE MILLAGE, I'M CERTAINLY GOING TO PRODUCE THIS IS WHAT THE NEW TAX BILL WOULD LOOK LIKE FOR THOSE TAXPAYER TYPES. THIS IS ALL NUMBERS TO ME. I DON'T HAVE A NARRATIVE, COMMISSIONER. THIS IS SIMPLY SOMETHING I INCLUDE EVERY YEAR WITH. THIS IS WHAT YOUR AVERAGE TAX BILL WOULD LOOK LIKE. THIS IS WHAT THE TAX IMPACT OF THE TAXPAYER WOULD BE. IF I HAD IT FIVE I'D PUT UP THE SLIDE AND SAY, HERE'S THE IMPACT ON THE SLIDE. I DO STILL SHOW WHAT FIVE MILLS WOULD BE ON THESE PEOPLE IF THAT'S THE ADOPTED MILLAGE. HERE'S WHAT THE 4.75 MILLS WOULD BE ON THESE PEOPLE AND WHAT THEIR PROPOSED TAX BILL WOULD BE, BUT THAT EVERY YEAR. BUT IN A BUSINESS FOR A BUDGET, RIGHT, WHERE ARE WE DEFICIENT? WHERE CAN WE CUT FROM A BUDGETARY STANDPOINT, REVIEWING YOUR INCOME? WELL, MY FIRST THING IS WE CUT WHAT'S THE BUDGET? WHAT DO WE NEED TO CUT SO THAT WE CAN BECAUSE I CUT $913,000 WORTH OF INSTEAD OF REVIEWING THE REVENUE. AND WE'RE MORE OR LESS OF IT'S COMING FROM WHAT IN THE BUDGET NEEDS TO GET CUT. WELL, WELL, WHERE ARE WE? STARTS WITH REVENUE. WHERE WE LEFT OFF IS I WAS ON THIS SLIDE. THAT WAS WHERE THE 913,950 GOES. ALREADY SAID IT'S NOT UP TO US RIGHT. NOT US TO GET. AND THEN YOU JUST 
          [01:30:09]
SAID THAT EARLIER. BUT THIS PRESENTATION IS, IS SUPPOSED TO BE A COMPREHENSIVE PRESENTATION OF THE BUDGET AND THE EFFECT OF THE DECISION WE MAKE. WE'RE NOT CONCENTRATING ON THIS OTHER THAN ANY OTHER. THE DECISION WE MAKE WILL BE RELEVANT TO THE MILLAGE THAT WE SET. CORRECT. THAT'S THE DECISION WE'RE GOING TO MAKE. THAT HAS TO DO WITH THE MONEY WE'RE SPENDING, NOT THE REVENUE COMING IN. THE REVENUE COMING IN IS WHAT IT IS. THE DECISIONS THAT WE'RE GOING TO MAKE AROUND WHERE WE SET OUR MILLAGE HAS TO DO WITH HOW WE'RE SPENDING MONEY. HAVING A PRESENTATION TODAY ON WHERE BUDGET IS IN, THE REVENUE IS WE'RE PRESENTING TO YOU AS THE STAFF OF HERE'S THE CURRENT REVENUE AT FIVE MILLS. AND HERE IS WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE. IF YOU'RE REDUCING IT TO 4.75 MILLS. HERE'S WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE. AND HERE'S WHO SAVES FROM THAT. AND HERE'S WHAT THOSE SAVINGS ARE FOR A HOUSE AT 50,000, A HOUSE AT 200,000, A HOUSE AT 500,000, AND A HOUSE AT 10 MILLION. TO SHOW WHAT THE REVENUE AND WHAT THE PAYMENT THE HOUSES ARE GOING TO BE MAKING PAY TO GENERATE THAT REVENUE. ONCE YOU FINISH THAT AND DETERMINE THE REVENUE, OR FOR THAT MATTER, THE AD VALOREM ON THE REVENUE, THE REVENUE, THEN WE GO TO THE EXPENDITURE SIDE. 
          AND YOU'RE RIGHT. YOU SAY TO ME, WE'RE GOING TO MAKE THE AD VALOREM TWO MILLS, AND WE HAVE TO GO OUT AND REMOVE WHATEVER THAT AMOUNT IS. I AGREE, I'M JUST MY POINT IS WITH LIKE WHAT, 30 MINUTES LEFT OR WHATEVER IT IS? COMMISSIONER, I, I, I LEFT OFF AT ZONING FEES AND I JUST SAID I DON'T KNOW WHAT UTILITY TAX PROPANE DID, BUT IT'S REALLY KICKING IT THIS YEAR. AND WE WENT FAR AFOUL FROM THERE. SO I WAS IN THE MIDDLE OF GOING THROUGH REVENUES AND SAYING FOR YOU TO SAY, HOW AM I GOING TO BALANCE THIS BUDGET? WELL, THE FIRST THING I'M SHOWING YOU IS HOW I DIDN'T JUST PAD THE BUDGET AND I WAS EXPLAINING WHAT EACH OF MY REVENUE CHOICES ARE AND WHY WE'RE UPPING THOSE. I COULD COME IN HERE AND JUST PLUG $3 MILLION AND BE LIKE, DONE, RIGHT? BUT THAT THAT WOULDN'T HOLD MUSTER. IT WOULD BE A HOLE IN THE BUDGET. SO I WAS TRYING TO EXPLAIN TO YOU, AND I THINK IT DID GENERATE CONVERSATION, LIKE, WHY DID YOU DO THIS? WHERE DOES THAT COME FROM? SO I, I WAS GOING AT REVENUES FIRST AND SAYING, THESE ARE THE REVENUES THAT HAVE CHANGED SINCE WE LAST MET, JUST FOR ME. LIKE I WOULD WANT TO SEE WHAT THE BUDGET WAS LAST YEAR, WHAT IS PROPOSED THIS YEAR, WHAT THE DIFFERENCE IS AND WHAT THAT SINGLE DIGIT INCREASE LOOKS LIKE ACROSS THE DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS. AND THEN WE MAKE IT 0.25 LESS VERSUS FIVE. WHAT THE WHO'S GENERATING YOU KNOW WHO SAVES IF IT'S FIVE VERSUS ZERO POINT FROM A BUDGET STANDPOINT OKAY. I, I WOULD STILL HAVE TO PRODUCE THIS SCHEDULE FOR THE BUDGET ANYWAY. IN THE FIRST IN THE FIRST WORKSHOP, THE BUDGETS SNEAK PEEK, YOU DID SEE THAT IN GENERAL, FUND BUDGET WENT UP 1%, IT WENT UP $358,000. AND THERE WERE MANY DEPARTMENTS WHO HAD REDUCED THEIR BUDGET, CUT THEIR BUDGET, EVERYTHING. AND I'VE SAID THIS TO THE DEPARTMENTS AT THE STAFF MEETING IN REGULAR. IN A NORMAL YEAR, I'D BE LIKE, GREAT JOB EVERYONE. IT WOULD STILL BE HARD TO FIND THE MONEY BECAUSE I SAID AT THE BEGINNING OF TODAY'S WORKSHOP, THE DIFFERENCE IS WE'VE MOVED FROM CAPITAL EXPENDITURES THAT I COULD FUND WITH IMPACT FEES TO COMMISSIONER JOBS POINT TO MORE OPERATING AND PERSONNEL, WHICH I CAN'T FUND WITH IMPACT FEES. SO THE FIRST THING IS I GOT TO FIND MONEY TO FUND SOME OF THESE THESE ISSUES, RIGHT. IF THESE PROGRAMS ARE GOING TO BE KEPT, THE PROGRAMS THAT ARE BEING KEPT STILL HAVE TO BE FUNDED. ON OUR VERY FIRST SLIDE, WE STARTED WITH EVEN AT FIVE MILLS, I'M STILL A MILLION OUT. BUT THAT KIND OF INFORMATION FEELS MORE RELEVANT FOR US TO MAKE THE DECISION WE'RE GOING TO MAKE. YES, SIR. AND MY POINT, I'M STILL GOING TO PRODUCE A CHART OF WHAT THE AVERAGE TAXPAYER IMPACT IS GOING TO BE. THE FACT THAT YOU DIDN'T WANT TO SEE IT TODAY. I APOLOGIZE THAT YOU DIDN'T WANT TO SEE IT. I'M STILL GOING TO MAKE IT OKAY. OKAY. JUST IF YOU GO ON OUR WEBSITE, WHICH YOU UPGRADE, THAT INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE, RIGHT. HIGHLIGHT EACH YEAR YOU CAN WELL YEAH. EACH CATEGORY ON OUR ON OUR WEBSITE, WHAT'S AVAILABLE UNDER WHAT'S CALLED THE TRANSPARENCY PORTAL IS A REAL TIME NUMBER OF OUR CURRENT BUDGET, YEAR TO DATE EXPENSES AND ALL OF OUR PRIVATE PRIOR YEAR TO DATE EXPENSES ALL THERE AT LEAST TO 2022. NOW WE HAVE MORE HISTORICAL DATA AVAILABLE. 
          WHAT'S NOT ON OUR BUDGET RIGHT NOW OR ON OUR WEBSITE RIGHT NOW IS THIS BUDGET. BECAUSE IT IS NOT YOUR TENTATIVE BUDGET. IT'S NOT AN ADOPTED BUDGET. IT'S STILL A WORKING PRODUCT. SOME OTHER GOVERNMENTS HAVE ALREADY POSTED WHAT THEY CALL THEIR TENTATIVE BUDGET, BUT YOU HAVEN'T ACTUALLY THEY HAVEN'T ADOPTED ONE UNTIL THAT FIRST HEARING IN SEPTEMBER PER TRIM. 
          [01:35:04]
SO WHAT I WAS TELLING COMMISSIONER REED BEFORE THE MEETING STARTED, AFTER YOU ADOPT THE TENTATIVE BUT THE TENTATIVE MILLAGE AND THE TENTATIVE BUDGET ON SEPTEMBER 8TH, THE NEXT MORNING ON SEPTEMBER 9TH, THAT TENTATIVE BUDGET WOULD THAT MILLAGE WILL BE AVAILABLE. AND THEN FOR THAT TWO WEEKS BETWEEN, YOU'LL WAIT AND THEN ON SEPTEMBER 22ND, YOU'LL ADOPT THE FINAL MILLAGE AND THE FINAL BUDGET, AND THEN THAT BUDGET WILL BE AVAILABLE ON THE WEBSITE AS WELL. NOW, IS IT THE FINAL DOCUMENT THAT I SUBMIT TO SEE IF WE'RE GOING TO WIN THE BUDGET AWARD? MAYBE NOT, BUT IT WOULD BE THE DOCUMENT WITH THE NUMBERS AND THE GUTS IN IT. OKAY, SO THAT'S WHERE YOU GET THE BY LINE ITEM ACCOUNT. SO OVERTIME HERE'S OVERTIME THIS THAT HOWEVER MUCH YOU WANT TO SEE IN IT. YOU KNOW THE BEAN COUNTER GODS DON'T REQUIRE US TO PUT SEVEN COLUMNS IN THERE. BUT IF MY COMMISSIONERS WANT SEVEN COLUMNS IN THERE, I'LL PUT SEVEN COLUMNS IN THERE TODAY. WHAT I WAS TRYING TO SHOW YOU IS BETWEEN THE 3,000,009 I LEFT YOU AT. AND TODAY, HOW WE GOT TO 1,000,093 OR WHATEVER IT IS AT FIVE MILLS AND HOW WE GOT TO 2,000,023 AT 4.75 MILLS. OKAY. SO I'M SORRY, I'VE, I HAVE MANIPULATED SOME REVENUE SINCE WE LAST TALKED. 
          AND I WAS TRYING TO EXPLAIN MY RATIONALE BETWEEN DOING THOSE REVENUES. AND THEN WE GOT WAY OFF TOPIC. SO YES, THE PRESENTATION HAS TAKEN WAY LONGER THAN IT WAS SUPPOSED TO, BUT, YOU KNOW, SO THERE I WAS. I WAS JUST LEAVING OFF THAT I FELT COMFORTABLE UPPING. I WOULDN'T FEEL COMFORTABLE, COMMISSIONER, JUST GOING IN AND PLUGGING A NUMBER LIKE, HEY, YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO DO 4.75 MILLS. WE'RE OUT OF BUDGET BY 2 MILLION. I COULD GO DOWN TO THE BOTTOM LINE, SAY, I'M GOING TO MAKE 2 MILLION IN WIDGETS. THANKS. DONE. BUDGETS BALANCED. HAVE A NICE DAY. FOR ME IT IS. IT IS ALL JUST NUMBERS. AND THEY'RE VERY PRECISE NUMBERS DOWN TO THE DENTAL PLAN ON AN EMPLOYEE IN A. SO THERE'S A I'M GOING TO GET VERY PARTICULAR WITH YOU RIGHT HERE. THAT'S WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR. YOU WANTED THE ENVIRONMENTAL ATTORNEY. WELL SOME STUFF I CAN'T PRESENT HERE IN PUBLIC. BUT YOU WANTED THE ENVIRONMENTAL ATTORNEYS BUDGET TO BE $300,000 BECAUSE OF A CHANGE IN THE DENTAL PLAN, IT'S NOW $299,843. NOT THAT LEVEL, RIGHT. BUT I TO ME, THAT IS, I HAVE TO DO THAT TOO. SO I'M GOING TO GO BACK AND ADJUST THE BUDGET TO MAKE THAT BUDGET $300,000, WHEREVER I HAVE TO DO THAT, TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN. OKAY, SO THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED. A DENTAL PLAN FOR THAT EMPLOYEE. AND THERE'S ONLY ONE EMPLOYEE IN THAT DEPARTMENT. THAT DENTAL PLAN CHANGED, WHICH CHANGED MY BUDGET NUMBER. AND IT FLOWS ALL THE WAY THROUGH THE ENTIRE BUDGET. SO FOR ME, YOU'RE YOU'RE DEFINITELY TALKING ABOUT YOU WANT THE 5000 LEVEL HIGH FLY OVER THE AIRPORT. I'M TRYING TO GIVE YOU 5000 WITHOUT GETTING CAUGHT DOWN ON THE RUNWAY WHERE I AM AND SAY, YOU KNOW, WE REALLY DO. OKAY. REVENUE. YEAH. 
          MORE AROUND. OKAY. I MEAN, THAT'S A I WANTED TO GIVE SOME SHOUT OUTS LIKE TO THE FIRE DEPARTMENT. THEIR AMBULANCE FEES ARE UP BECAUSE THEY DONE SOME SOFTWARE AND YOU KNOW AND THEY'VE, THEY'VE DONE SOME PROCESS CHANGE. YOU KNOW WHERE THAT IS. OKAY. WE'LL TALK ABOUT THAT. JUST MR. MORTEL WE DON'T HAVE A HARD STOP. YOU GUYS ARE THE BOARD. WE HAVE ANOTHER MEETING, BUT IT CAN START WHENEVER THIS ONE'S FINISHED. I MEAN, IT JUST THE ADVERTISING IS JUST START HERE. SO. BUT IT DOESN'T HAVE TO START AT FOUR. IT'S JUST THAT WE'LL PICK IT UP WHENEVER WE START. I THINK THAT THE TAPE RECORDING MIGHT HAVE. WE HAVE TO MAKE ANY DECISIONS THIS EVENING WITH REGARD TO. YOU DON'T HAVE TO VOTE ON ANYTHING TO ADOPT THE BUDGET, BUT THE AS MUCH DIRECTION AS YOU CAN GIVE ME. LIKE, YOU KNOW, IF YOU SAID I DON'T WE DO NOT WANT TO PROVIDE GARBAGE SERVICE ANYMORE. THAT WOULD BE VERY CLEAR DIRECTION. OBVIOUSLY YOU'RE NOT GOING TO SAY THAT, BUT ANY DIRECTION YOU GIVE AND I'M USING IT AS AN EXAMPLE BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO, YOU KNOW, GET PEOPLE WORKED UP OVER STUFF. GARBAGE WILL STILL CONTINUE TO BE. BUT IT'S CLEAR. I MEAN, I'M I'M CLEARLY HEARING DIRECTED AT THE LAST MEETING TO NOT TOUCH FIRE POLICE AND UTILITIES. RIGHT, RIGHT. AND THAT'S PRETTY SPECIFIC BUT I BUT BUT YOU ALSO DIRECTED TO REDUCE THE AD VALOREM BY 0.25 WHICH IS 100% FIRE AND POLICE. YES. SO IT HAS A EFFECT BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO THEN GO TO OTHER SOURCES TO FILL THAT PATCH. I BELIEVE I ALSO HEARD MR. I MEAN, YOU DON'T WANT YOU DON'T WANT AS MANY REDUCTIONS IN SERVICE AS POSSIBLE. SORRY. I SPLIT THE MONITORS SO I COULD SEE YOU. YOU KNOW, I NEED A PHONE BOOK OVER HERE SO I CAN KIND OF OMINOUS FOR MY UNCLE, YOU KNOW? SO IN IN THE ATTEMPT WITH THE MANAGER THAT THAT'S WHAT OUR GAME IS, IS HE SAYS LIKE TO GARBAGE FOR HIS EXAMPLE. SAY, WELL, WHAT IF WE CUT GARBAGE? I'M LIKE, THAT'S NOT GOING TO HELP YOU. THAT'S IN THE SANITATION FUND. OH, YOU KNOW WHAT? IF WE CUT THE TRAM SERVICE, LIKE, THAT'S NOT GOING TO HELP YOU. THE CRA PAYS FOR THAT. THAT'S JUST GENERAL GENERAL FUND. AND SO EACH ONE OF THESE PROPOSALS AND 
          [01:40:04]
POSSIBILITIES IS WHERE WE RUN DOWN TO WHAT IS THE ACTUAL EFFECT ON. SO BY YOU CUTTING THE MILLAGE 0.25 MILLS, IF THAT'S WHAT YOU DO. IT DID REDUCE AD VALOREM 913,000, BUT IT GAVE US BACK 152 FROM THE CRA. SO THE NET EFFECT WAS 760 SOMETHING THOUSAND. RIGHT. THAT IS WHAT I'M SO, SO IN RIGHT IN EVERY MILL OR EVERY QUARTER MILL. THAT'S WHAT THAT WOULD BE. EVERY MILLAGE WOULD BE 3,000,008 3,000,005. SO THAT THAT'S WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE RUNNING THROUGH THESE SCENARIOS AND BELIEVE ME, THERE'S SOME CRAZY SCENARIOS ON ON MY LITTLE NOTEBOOK, YOU KNOW, AND ALL WE'RE DOING IS WAITING TO PLUG THEM INTO THAT FOUR B TO DO IT. 
          SO WHAT I YOU KNOW, WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR IS YOU TO GIVE THE MANAGER DIRECTION. IF WE'RE IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION, IF WE'RE GOING WHATEVER THAT'S TO GO FORWARD WITH. I'LL GIVE YOU MY QUICK IS THAT'S THE DIRECTION I APPRECIATE WHERE YOU'VE GONE SO FAR WITH FOR A. I WANT YOU TO EXERCISE FOUR B WITH 0.25 AS THE TARGET AND GET AS CLOSE AS YOU CAN TO THAT, IF NOT AT THAT AS POSSIBLE, IS MY DIRECTION. FOR ALL THE REASONS I MENTIONED EARLIER. ONE. YEAH, THAT'S MY DIRECTION. YEAH. COMMISSIONER, I JUST HAVE A FEW MINOR QUESTIONS WHEN I WAS GOING THROUGH. BY THE WAY, THANK YOU FOR SENDING ME THE BUDGET SO THAT I COULD LOOK AT IT. I NOTICED, AND THESE ARE SMALL AMOUNTS COMPARED TO WHAT IT IS WE NEED. BUT EVERY LITTLE AMOUNT HELPS THE TWO. THE 2026 BUDGET STILL SHOWS 25 K GOING TO THE MARTIN COUNTY BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT BOARD, WHICH HAD ALREADY REDUCED IT OUT OF THE 2025. I GUESS MY QUESTION WAS, WHY WAS IT NOW IN THE 26? THAT WAS THE INITIAL. SO THAT'S WHAT CAME IN FROM LIKE LAST YEAR'S BUDGET. IT WAS PUT TOGETHER WHEN IT'S SUBMITTED BY EVERYBODY, IT WAS SUBMITTED. I DON'T THINK IT'S STILL. NO, IT'S NOT THERE NOW. IT'S GONE. SO. OH OKAY. BECAUSE I LOOKED AT IT ON THE LINE. IT WAS IN THE 2026. YEAH. 
          YEAH. AND IT AND IT WAS THAT. SO THAT WAS THE INITIAL WHAT YOU GOT WAS A SNAPSHOT IN TIME IN MARCH OF THIS YEAR. AND THAT WAS THE INITIAL BUDGET NUMBERS THAT JOLIE AND I STARTED WORKING WITH TO MAKE THOSE ADJUSTMENTS. BUT THAT 25,000 HAS BEEN REMOVED IN A, IN A LARGE NUMBER, COMMISSIONER, 1.5 MILLION OF REDUCTION THAT ITEMIZATIONS THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT WHAT I WHAT WE TRIED TO PROVIDE YOU THAT THOSE ITEMS WERE WHEN WE WERE OUT BY 3.9 MILLION. SO ALREADY THERE'S 1,000,005 OF THAT IS GONE AND HAS BEEN CUT AND ALTERED. AND SO YOU GOT THE DETAIL. YEAH, I GOT THE DETAIL OF HOW OF HOW IT CAME TO 3.9 MILLION. BECAUSE IF THERE'S SOMETHING IN THERE THAT WE HAVEN'T ADDRESSED, I WANT TO BE ABLE TO ADDRESS IT. RIGHT. IF YOU IF YOU LOOK I MEAN, I, YOU KNOW, WE'LL JUST GIVE YOU A CHECKLIST LIKE DONE DONE DONE. OH WAIT A MINUTE. WE HAVEN'T DONE THAT ONE, YOU KNOW. WELL, I CERTAINLY HOPE I'M WRONG, BUT I HOPE HE WOULDN'T VOTE BEFORE WE HEAR FROM THE PUBLIC. WE'RE NOT. WE'RE KIND OF IN THE MIDDLE OF MY QUESTIONS. OKAY, OKAY, OKAY. 
          AND THERE SEEM TO BE TWO LINE WAGES. THEY MAY JUST BE, BUT THEY WERE BOTH UNDER STORMWATER ONE NON DEPARTMENTAL AND ONE UNDER STORMWATER MAINTENANCE. ARE THEY TWO SEPARATE DEPARTMENTS OR. YES MA'AM PER HAVE BEEN COUNTING STANDARDS. WE KEEP THE AND IT'S CALLED STORMWATER NON-DEPARTMENTAL. SO THOSE ARE EXPENDITURES THAT HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE PEOPLE IN STORMWATER. IT'S SIMPLY THINGS THAT THAT FUND MUST BOOK. EACH ONE OF THE FUNDS HAS ONE OF THOSE. GENERAL FUND AS A NON-DEPARTMENTAL WATER SEWER HAS A NON-DEPARTMENTAL SANITATION HAS ONE. THE ONLY ONE THAT DOESN'T HAVE A SPECIFIC ONE IS CRA OKAY, BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE TO PLAY WITH ANYONE ELSE. WHEN I WAS GOING THROUGH LINE BY LINE, THERE WAS NO DEFINITION FOR THE $1 MILLION UNDER THE CITY MAYOR FUNCTION. I MEAN, WELL, WE ATTENDING THAT MANY FUNCTIONS. THAT WAS 1000, COMMISSIONER. OH, IT LOOKED LIKE A MILLION. I WAS LIKE, ARE WE ATTENDING THAT? NO, BUT WE COULD. THAT'D BE GREAT. BUT WE WOULD HAVE BEEN EASY TO CUT. BUT WE DID CUT IT. NO, NO, WE DID CUT IT. WE CUT THE THOUSAND DOLLARS. YES, IT IS GONE. THAT THOUSAND DOLLARS FOR MAYOR FUNCTIONS. OKAY. ALRIGHT. SO I JUST LOOKED AT THIS THIS LAST WEEK. SO THERE HAVE BEEN A LOT OF CHANGES ALREADY SINCE I'VE LOOKED AT IT, AND I THINK THAT WAS IT. AND I'M NOT AN HR, I'M NOT LOOKING TO TELL ANYONE, BUT I HELPED MY BOSS RUN A SMALL BUSINESS AND WHENEVER HEALTH PLANS AND WHATNOT GOT OUT OF HAND, BECAUSE THEY DO GO UP AND THEY, THEY GET CRAZY. HAS HAVE WE SHOPPED FOR NEWER HEALTH PLANS OR BETTER PRICED HEALTH PLANS? I DON'T KNOW, I'M JUST ASKING. WE HAVE. YEAH. OKAY. WE'RE WE'RE WE'RE WE'RE WE'RE IN A KIND OF A SELF-INSURED PROGRAM. AND THEN WE HAVE CIGNA ACT AS OUR HEALTH PLAN ADMINISTRATOR. SO I DON'T UTILIZE ANY OF THE BENEFITS. I DIDN'T NEED THEM, SO I DIDN'T TAKE THEM WELL. COMMISSIONER JOB, UNFORTUNATELY THIS HAS BEEN A BAD EXPERIENCE HERE FOR US. SO THIS WOULD BE LIKE YOU HAVING A VERY SERIOUS ACCIDENT THAT YOU'RE TO BLAME FOR AND THEN SHOPPING FOR CAR INSURANCE, RIGHT? YOUR QUOTE WOULD BE REALLY BAD IF YOU TRIED TO 
          [01:45:01]
SWITCH. WE NEED WE NEED THREE YEARS OF CLEAN. WE NEED THREE YEARS OF REALLY GOOD EXPERIENCE BEFORE WE'RE A GOOD CUSTOMER. RIGHT? YEAH. RIGHT. YEAH. OKAY. AND I'M VERY HAPPY ABOUT THE $1 MILLION UNDER THE CITY MAYOR FUNCTION. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. FLEW YOU ON A PRIVATE JET TO DINNER. YEAH, RIGHT. ALRIGHT. THAT WAS REALLY MY QUESTIONS, AND I DIDN'T REALIZE. AND I SHOULD HAVE REALIZED YOU'D BE CHANGING THOSE NUMBERS UP UNTIL THE DAY WE WERE MEETING TODAY. 
          WAS THE BOARD WISH TO HEAR THE REMAINDER OF FINANCE MANAGER'S BUDGET? BUDGET PRESENTATION? SURE. IF EVERYONE. OKAY. SURE. I WOULD LIKE TO. YES, I WOULD LIKE, MR. CLARK. OKAY, BUT YOU CAN SAY YES OR NO. OKAY, SO I'D LIKE TO SEE YOU WORK HARD. TO DO WHAT? SIR? I SAID I'D LIKE TO SEE IT. YOU WORK HARD DOING THIS. OH, YEAH? WELL, AND WE SO APPRECIATE IT. IT'S NOT EASY DOING NUMBERS AND CRUNCHING THEM, AND NONE OF US LIKE TO DO IT. THERE'S SOME COMPANY OR A CITY. THIS IS A THIS IS ONE OF THE MORE DIFFICULT ONES IN RECENT HISTORY THAT I KNOW OF. 
          SO HERE YOU'RE LOOKING AT SOME NUMBERS AND AGAIN, BECAUSE AS I'VE SPOKEN WITH SOME OF YOU, SOME OF THESE LINE ITEMS WERE JUST TALKING ABOUT ACCOUNT TOTALS HERE BECAUSE SOME OF THE INFORMATION IS NOT PUBLIC YET. AND SO, YOU KNOW, I THE MANAGER HAS FROZEN SOME POSITIONS AND ELIMINATED SOME OTHER ONES. SO I WOULDN'T WANT TO GET TO THE GRANULAR DETAIL OF POSITIONS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. AND THE EMPLOYEES ALREADY ARE, YOU KNOW, KIND OF PAYING ATTENTION. I'VE SEEN MORE EMPLOYEES IN THIS BUDGET WORKSHOP TODAY THAN IN MANY, SEVERAL PAST YEARS. SO THERE WERE SOME THINGS, LIKE THERE WERE EXPENSES FOR BUILDINGS THAT, YOU KNOW, THE MANAGER WAS LIKE, NO, WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO THAT. MACHINERY AND EQUIPMENT. I KNOW THAT THE DIRECTION AT THE LAST MEETING, I KNOW THERE WAS A COMMENT ABOUT, YOU KNOW, NOT CUTTING CAPITAL PROJECTS OR INFRASTRUCTURE THINGS. THESE WERE SOME TOYS THAT DIDN'T NEED TO BE DONE. 
          HOWEVER, WE DID FUND SOME PROJECTS THAT NEEDED TO BE FUNDED AND PUT INTO THE INTO THE BUDGET. THERE WAS A PRINCIPAL ERROR ROUNDING. SO TO MY POINT A SECOND AGO, COMMISSIONER, ABOUT I'M DOWN ON THE RUNWAY WHILE YOU'RE LOOKING FOR THE 500 ZERO FOOT VIEW, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS A $3,132 ROUNDING ERROR IN ONE OF THE DEBT SERVICE PAYMENTS THAT HAD TO BE FIXED. REPAIRS AND MAINTENANCE. WE'VE DEFERRED SOME OF THAT. AND THOSE ARE 475,000 127,000 IN IN OTHER KINDS OF CONTRACTUAL SERVICES, $63,000 IN LICENSES AND OTHER KINDS OF STUFF, SOME SOFTWARE ISSUES THAT PEOPLE WANTED, $9,000 WORTH OF COPIERS AND SOME OTHER THINGS THAT THAT CUT BOOKS AND MEMBERSHIPS. THERE WAS SOME OUTDATED ONES THERE, YOU KNOW, STILL EVEN LIKE SOME MEMBERSHIPS AT THE COUNTY LEVEL THAT WE DON'T NEED AT THE MUNICIPAL LEVEL, PRINTING AND BINDING, WE'RE ON IT. WE'RE MOVING INTO A PAPERLESS ENVIRONMENT AND TRYING TO DO AS LITTLE ON PAPER AS POSSIBLE TRAVEL AND PER DIEM. THE MANAGER FEELS LIKE TRAINING IS IMPORTANT. AND SO LOOKING AT TRAVEL AND PER DIEM SEEMS LIKE A LIKE A HOT BUTTON ISSUE, BUT IT'S ACTUALLY DIRECTLY TIED TO TRAINING AND EDUCATION. AND SOME EMPLOYEES HAVE CERTIFICATIONS THAT THEY NEED TO MAINTAIN AND ALWAYS STAY ABREAST OF NEW STUFF. THE GENERAL LIABILITY. I'D ALREADY SAID THAT THERE WAS A 7% REDUCTION. NOW THAT WAS IN THE 3,000,009 OUT OF BALANCE. I HAD ALREADY CUT THE INSURANCE BY 7%. AGAIN, TO MY POINT, I FOUND $180 PROBLEM THAT HAD TO BE CUT. SO AS YOU SAID, EVERY DOLLAR COUNTS AND ADDS TO THAT COMMUNICATION SERVICES, YOU KNOW, A ROUNDING ERROR. AND THEN SOME THINGS WE DID WE DID ADD $86 TO SOMEONE'S OFFICE SUPPLIES TO MAKE A NUMBER WORK, FREIGHT AND POSTAGE. SOMEONE HAD LEFT IT OUT. LIKE YOU REALLY NEED THAT PROMOTIONAL ACTIVITIES. THAT'S MORE OF A RECLASSIFICATION. OPERATING SUPPLIES, PROFESSIONAL SERVICES. WE DID THAT. AND THEN THE FLEET VEHICLE LEASE. THERE'S THAT. THERE'S $100,000 ADJUSTMENT THERE JUST BECAUSE SOMEONE HAD THEIR MATH WRONG. BUT ON OUR PREVIOUS SLIDE TODAY, WE TALKED ABOUT CUTTING 261 OUT OF IT BY FUNDING SOME OF THOSE PURCHASES. SO THIS IS A THIS IS A NET NUMBER KIND OF SITUATION HERE. 4 MILLION OUT OF INTERGOVERNMENTAL TRANSFERS. NOW SOME OF THOSE TRANSFERS WERE TO OUTSIDE ORGANIZATIONS. SOME WERE TO JUST INTERNAL FUND ACCOUNTING AND SOME WERE FUNDING THOSE RESERVES THAT WE'VE ALREADY REDUCED. SO THERE WAS A BIG CHUNK THERE. AND THEN ALSO THINGS LIKE CONTINGENCIES, I TRY TO PUT A CONTINGENCY IN THE FUNDS FOR THIS, HOWEVER, THAT, YOU KNOW, WE REDUCE THOSE. WE'RE JUST GOING TO ROLL THE DICE AND HOPE EVERYTHING WORKS WELL. 
          20,000 OTHER USES IS SIMPLY THINGS LIKE FUNDING, DEPRECIATION, THOSE THOSE KIND 
          [01:50:03]
OF REALLY BEAN COUNTER DEEP THINGS. AND THEN BECAUSE OF THOSE CHANGES I HAD MENTIONED IN. THE FRS, THE HEALTH INSURANCE, THE UNION NEGOTIATIONS, THIS IS THE NET CHANGE TO THOSE PERSONAL SERVICE ACCOUNTS, FICA RETIREMENT, SPECIAL PAY, LIFE AND HEALTH AND REGULAR SALARIES. SO EVEN THOUGH THERE'S REDUCTIONS THERE BECAUSE OF SOME POSITION FREEZING AND POSITION REMOVAL, THEY'RE STILL WOUND UP BEING A NET POSITIVE CHANGE TO THOSE NUMBERS. SO THAT WAS ADDED TO THE BUDGET. AND SO, YOU KNOW, IT WASN'T JUST FINDING THE 3.9 MILLION. WE ACTUALLY GOT WORSE BEFORE WE GOT BETTER TO GET THERE. SO THAT'S WHAT TAKES US DOWN TO THE POINT WE ARE TODAY WITH THE 2 MILLION. 223 BECAUSE I HAVE ALREADY PUT THAT REVENUE REDUCTION IN THE BUDGET JUST SO THAT IT WASN'T LEFT OUT AT THE LAST MINUTE, YOU KNOW, AND DONE ON JUST EXCEL. BUT I HAVE SET IT UP. SO THAT COMMISSIONER YOU SAID IS CLOSE AS WE COULD GET. SO YES, IT IF IT WINDS UP GLIDING IN AND YOU VOTE FOR A 4.9 MILLS OR WHATEVER IT IS, IT'S EASILY ENOUGH ADJUSTED AND BUT AGAIN IT WOULD FLOW THROUGH THE ENTIRE BUDGET AND WOULD. RIGHT. IT'S LIKE IF THE DENTAL PLAN CHANGES BY $1, I HAVE TO CHANGE ALL 600 PAGES OF THE BUDGET PRACTICALLY, SO THAT THAT IS WHERE WE'RE AT. AND SO WE WEREN'T GOING TO GET ANY MORE INTO DETAIL SINCE SOME THINGS ARE VERY FLUID RIGHT NOW. SO I WOULD TAKE FURTHER QUESTIONS OR DIRECTION OR. YES, JULIE. SO, YES. SO WE PRETTY MUCH KNOW THE REVENUE AT THIS POINT. IT COMES DOWN TO EXPENDITURES. IF I'M UNDERSTANDING YOU CORRECTLY, ALL THE DEPARTMENTS HAVE OR HAS UNION NEGOTIATIONS BEEN FINALIZED OR IS THAT. YES. SO UNION NEGOTIATIONS HAVE BEEN WELL, UNLESS THE UNION'S UNION. 
          YEAH, WE HAVE CONTRACT OPENING NEGOTIATIONS. WE'RE FINE WITH THE CONTRACTS. BUT THE UNIONS HAVEN'T TAKEN THAT. THEY HAVEN'T TOLD US WHETHER THEY'RE OPENING OR NOT. I TOLD THEM TO COME TODAY TO MEASURE THE TOLERANCE OF THE BOARD. YEAH. AND IS THIS SOMETHING THAT CAN BE DONE SOONER? SO IT'S NOT LIKE A. WELL, I TOLD THEM THAT I DIDN'T THINK IT'D BE A GOOD YEAR TO OPEN, BECAUSE IF THEY OPEN THE CONTRACTS, I WAS GOING TO BE ASKING THEM TO SUBJECT THEIR CONTRACTS TO THESE SAME REDUCTIONS, BECAUSE WHEN THE CONTRACTS WERE ENTERED, WE HAD ANOTHER MILLION DOLLARS IN THE BUDGET. SO IF THEY OPENED THE CONTRACT, I'M SAYING, GREAT, NOW YOUR DEPARTMENT HAS COME TO THE TABLE, TO YOUR EMPLOYEES ARE NOW SUBJECT TO THE REDUCTIONS. YOUR STAFFING IS SUBJECT TO THE REDUCTIONS. YOUR EQUIPMENT IS SUBJECT TO THE REDUCTIONS, AND WE CAN ALL SHARE IN IT. IF THEY DON'T OPEN THE NEGOTIATIONS, THEY CAN LIVE BY THEIR CONTRACT. 
          AND I HAVE TO OBLIGE IT BECAUSE I'M OBLIGATED TO. AND THEY CAN DO THAT AT ANY TIME BETWEEN NOW AND THIS. THIS MONTH IS WHEN IT WOULD BE. THEY'RE GOING TO IT'D HAVE TO BE LIKE NEXT WEEK OR THE WEEK AFTER. WE'LL KNOW. AND THEN WHAT ARE WE WAITING FOR FROM DEPARTMENTS? JOLIE. FOR NOTHING. 
          NOTHING, NOTHING, SIR. THEY SUBMITTED EVERYTHING TO ME. OKAY. AND THEN JOLIE AND I SIT DOWN AND TELL THEM, KNOW THE WANTS AND NEEDS, AS JOLIE SAID. YEAH, IT WAS, YOU KNOW, IT'S A IT'S A FUN GAME. THE DEPARTMENT HEAD LEAVES AND WE'RE LIKE, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME. HAVE A GREAT DAY. AND THEN THEY LEAVE THE ROOM. WE'RE LIKE, WELL THAT'S GETTING DID OFFER UP SOME SOME THINGS THAT THEY SAID, OKAY, THESE ARE WANTS NOT NEEDS. AND THEY DID TELL US WHAT WERE NEEDS. AND THIS BUDGET CURRENTLY DOES ITS BEST TO KEEP THE NEEDS. AND WE DID TAKE THE, YOU KNOW, THE ONES THAT THEY OFFERED UP FREELY. AND THEN THE MANAGER WENT A LITTLE YOU KNOW ONCE HE GOT A TASTE HE WENT A LITTLE DEEPER. SO AND THEN THAT FOR B IS SOME OF THOSE OTHER ONES THAT WE'RE HOLDING IN OUR POCKET THAT WERE, YOU KNOW, LOOKING TO SEE WHICH IS GOING TO BE THE, THE MOST DOABLE. AND AS FAR AS REVENUES, COMMISSIONER. SO BACK TO THAT REVENUE SHEET, WE COULD STILL GET SOME REVENUES BECAUSE THE STATE OF FLORIDA HASN'T RELEASED ALL THE REVENUES YET. SO, YOU KNOW, COMMUNICATION SERVICE TAX HAS BEEN TRENDING DOWN BUT STILL WAY SLOWER THAN WHAT THE YOU KNOW, TALLAHASSEE PREACHED GLOOM AND DOOM ABOUT TEN YEARS AGO. AND THEY SAID IT WAS GOING TO BE GONE BY NOW. IT KEEPS DROPPING LIKE, YOU KNOW, 1%. SO IT'S NOT IT'S NOT A MAJOR THING. BUT AS WE'VE ADDED MORE PEOPLE, MORE PAYERS, THE REVENUE HAS STAYED STEADIER THAN EVEN DROPPING THE ONE. SO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M SAYING? NO, I UNDERSTAND AND I GUESS FOR, FOR FUTURE BUDGET WORKSHOPS, BECAUSE THERE'S STILL A COUPLE OVER THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS I'M GOING TO BE A PART OF. YES. IS THERE ANY WAY THAT I CAN GET THE WANTS AND THE NEEDS LIST 
          [01:55:02]
JUST FOR MY. SO I HAVE THIS, BUT HOW DO I KNOW ITS WANTS AND NEEDS EXACTLY LIKE EVERYTHING IS THAT THAT'S WHAT IT IS. IT'S THEY DON'T WRITE I WANT THIS OR I NEED. THAT'S WHERE YOU. 
          EVERYTHING THEY SAY IS THIS IS DESPERATE. WE ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO HAVE THIS OR WE'RE GOING TO DIE. 
          THERE IS. IF THEY TELL ME IT'S A WANT. YEAH. PUT A LINE THROUGH IT. RIGHT. THEN WHAT THEY'RE TALKING, YOU KNOW, ONE TIME COMMISSIONER. IS THAT JUST HOW IT'S DESCRIBED? YES. OH YEAH. 
          YEAH. ONE TIME WHEN I WAS A KID, MY DAD SAID I HAD ACCUMULATED A LOT OF JUNK. MY BACK HURTS AND I WANT $1 MILLION RIGHT NOW, BUT I'M NOT GOING TO GET IT RIGHT. AND I THINK THAT THAT'S. AND THEY, THEY HOLD THE ITEM UP IN FRONT OF YOU. AND IF YOU DIDN'T SAY KEEP IT LIKE INSTANTLY IT WAS LIKE LIKE IT WENT OUT THE WINDOW. YEAH. SO THERE WERE ITEMS THAT THE DEPARTMENT DIRECTORS WERE LIKE, I MUST HAVE THAT. AND THEN IF THEY'RE LIKE, WELL, WELL, LIKE, OKAY. AND I JUST PUT A LITTLE HIGHLIGHT ON IT. WHEN I MET WITH JOLIE, HE HAD LINES THROUGH STUFF. WHEN I SAID TO SOMEBODY, ARE YOU SURE? HE THOUGHT THAT MEANT TAKE IT OUT? YEAH, I MEAN, IT MAKES MORE SENSE NOW. THAT'S WHY I'M ASKING ALL THE QUESTIONS. NOT TARGETING ANYONE. AS I SAID TO COMMISSIONER. COMMISSIONER, READ THE PRINTOUT THAT YOU HAVE IS WHEN IT WAS 3,000,009 OUT OF BALANCE. SO THOSE NOTES NOW, THAT SAME REPORT WOULD HAVE, YOU KNOW, ALL THOSE NOTES ARE DIFFERENT NOW PDFS. WELL, THE WANTS AND NEEDS ARE REALLY WHAT YOU WANT NEED. IF YOU LOOK AT THOSE AND YOU SAY TO ME, I, YOU KNOW, THE RECOGNIZE THAT IF WE'RE REDUCING SERVICES ACROSS THE BOARD, WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE LIKE, LET'S SAY EVERY SINGLE PART GETS MOWED EVERY FIVE DAYS, WELL, I MIGHT MOVE IT TO EVERY SEVEN DAYS, BECAUSE THAT WAY WE CAN, THROUGH ATTRITION, HAVE LESS PEOPLE MOWING OR HAVE LESS PEOPLE DOING STUFF. AND I'M USING THAT AS AN EXAMPLE. IT'S NOT WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN. I'M JUST I WANT TO SAY THAT AGAIN, BUT NOW YOU'LL GET CALLS THAT, OH, THAT NEEDS TO BE TRIMMED OR THAT PARK NEEDS TO BE MOWED. AND YEAH, IT'LL GET MOWED AND IT'LL HAPPEN, BUT IT'S JUST GOING TO HAPPEN LESS OFTEN, RIGHT? RIGHT. WELL, LIKE JUST FOR EXAMPLE JOLIE THIS IS JUST THINKING OUTSIDE THE BOX, YOU KNOW, AND IT'S LIKE LIKE MIKE SAYS, SOMETIMES YOU GET INTO THE WEEDS OF SOME OF THESE NUMBERS, BUT LIKE TAKE FOR EXAMPLE, BACKGROUND CHECKS, LIKE, I'M ASSUMING THE CITY PAYS FOR BACKGROUND CHECKS FOR ALL EMPLOYEES, NEW HIRES. WELL, YES, WE DID FIND A DUPLICATION IN ONE OF THE DEPARTMENTS. ONE DEPARTMENT HAD ADDITIONAL BACKGROUND CHECKS ON THEIR DEPARTMENT THAT WE THERE WERE THREE DEPARTMENTS THAT HAD BACKGROUND CHECKS, OKAY. AND ONE WAS HR, ONE WAS POLICE AND ONE WAS RECREATION. AND WE ELIMINATED THE DUPLICATION OF THAT EXPENSE. OKAY. THERE'S ONLY ABOUT $1,200 YOU HAVE. YEAH, MINIMAL BACKGROUND CHECKS ON ON ALL EMPLOYEES. BUT WHEN WE HAD LIKE THE COMMUNITY SERVICES WAS PROVIDING THE AFTERCARE PROGRAM, EVERYBODY HAD TO HAVE AN EXTENSIVE BACKGROUND CHECK BECAUSE NOBODY COULD BE ALLOWED TO. AND POLICE HAVE TO AS WELL. 
          BUT SO THAT GOT CUT. RIGHT, RIGHT. THAT THAT EXTRA LEVEL OF BACKGROUND WAS CUT, DRUG TESTING FOR EVERY EMPLOYEE AND THINGS LIKE THAT AS WELL. AND DO YOU KNOW. THANK YOU JULIE. YEAH. 
          THANK YOU JULIE, YOU'VE BEEN SO PATIENT WITH US. NO NO NO. SO I I'LL SPEND THE REST OF TODAY IN THIS WEEK AND I'LL TRY AS QUICKLY AS TOMORROW TO GET YOU A, A BUTTONED UP PDF OR A POWERPOINT OF THE NUMBERS IN THE REPORTS. AND THEN THAT'LL BE WITH THE CITY. OH YEAH. YEAH YEAH YEAH. OH WE DO. YES. YEAH I JUST, I JUST BEFORE WE MOVE ON, I JUST HAVE A FEW COMMENTS. AND WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH A BUDGET OVER $90 MILLION, THE CHALLENGES, THE UNCERTAINTIES AND THAT'S THEY ARE THEY ARE ENORMOUS FOR A CITY. AND I'M JUST GOING TO PICK THREE OF THEM. AND THE FIRST IS THE AD VALOREM. AND WE CAN EXPECT THAT TO BE GOING DOWN PRETTY STEADILY. NOW. AS YOU KNOW, ECONOMY THE ECONOMY IS MOVE IN CYCLES. AND WE PEAKED AT 2008 IN AD VALOREM, AND IT TOOK US UNTIL 20 1922 TO RETURN TO THOSE VALUATIONS. AND WE HAVE HAD A DRAMATIC SPIKE IN HOME PRICES AS AS YOU KNOW, THOSE TEND TO ROLL OVER AND THEY'LL BE GOING DOWN PROBABLY FOR A WHILE. IN FACT, THE MEDIAN HOME SALES PRICE IN JANUARY OF 2025. AND STUART WAS DOWN 36.2%. AND THAT'S FROM THE BANK RATE MONITOR, WHO DOES A PRETTY GOOD JOB BECAUSE THEY DO MOST OF THE MORTGAGES. IT'S ALSO ON REDFIN. SO WE CAN EXPECT THAT NUMBER TO BE GOING DOWN. THE SECOND BIGGEST NUMBER WE HAVE REVENUE WISE IS INTEREST. AND IF WE'RE GOING TO PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT REPUBLICANS IN THE STATE OR THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT ARE SAYING, WHAT IS MR. TRUMP'S? ONE OF HIS BIGGEST PRIORITY RIGHT NOW IS TO FIRE THE FED CHIEF AND TO LOWER INTEREST RATES. THE 
          [02:00:03]
ONLY INTEREST RATE THE FED CONTROLS IS CALLED THE FED FUNDS RATE. IT'S AT 4.5%. HE WANTS TO CUT THAT TO ONE. HE WANTS TO CUT THAT BY TWO THIRDS. SO LET'S NOT BE THAT DRAMATIC. BUT IF INTEREST RATES GO DOWN JUST 40%, SO 40% 160, WE COULD LOSE $1.72 MILLION JUST IN INTEREST. AND WE CAN'T CONTROL THAT. THAT MEDIAN HOUSE PRICE WOULD GO UP THOUGH. WELL. SO COMMISSIONER, JUST TO SAY SINCE THAT THAT WAS A QUESTION THAT FILTERED THROUGH THE MANAGER TO ME, THE SO THE CITY WE HAVE A COMPREHENSIVE PORTFOLIO WHERE WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, THE MONEY IS DIVERSELY INVESTED. OKAY. AND WE HAVE MONEY IN CASH, WE HAVE MONEY IN A GOVERNMENT POOL, AND THEN WE HAVE MONEY IN A PORTFOLIO THAT TEARS OUT TO THE OLDEST INVESTMENT WE HAVE ONLY GOES OUT FIVE YEARS, BECAUSE I WOULDN'T WANT TO LOCK THE MONEY UP IN A IN A LOWER RATE IF A BETTER OPPORTUNITY COMES ALONG, RIGHT. UNFORTUNATELY, THOUGH, THE MAJORITY OF OUR INVESTMENTS ARE IN WHAT WE'RE ALLOWED TO INVEST IN BY STATE STATUTE, WHICH IS MOSTLY GOVERNMENT SECURITIES AND BONDS, WE HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF CORPORATE STOCK. BUT AS I'VE SAID IN THE PAST TWO MEETINGS, WHEN THE STOCK MARKET DOES BETTER, THE BOND MARKET DOES WORSE. AND SO THE CITY'S EARNINGS GO DOWN. WE ALSO WE MOVE MONEY UP AND MOVE MONEY DOWN ON A WEEKLY BASIS. AND SO IF WE WRITE A BIG CHECK FOR, YOU KNOW, A WATER SEWER PROJECT, THE PRINCIPAL THAT'S INVESTED FOR THAT PERIOD, I JUST RATED THAT PRINCIPAL THAT'S INVESTED FOR A PERIOD OF TIME UNTIL THE MONEY GETS REPLENISHED OR WE GET A REIMBURSEMENT FROM SRF. THAT'S ONE OF OUR INFAMOUS ONES. SO, YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAD $1 MILLION IN THE ACCOUNT, YOU JUST WROTE A CHECK FOR HALF A MILLION. WELL, NOW YOU'RE YOU'RE ONLY INVESTING 500,000 FOR A, YOU KNOW, TWO WEEKS OR A MONTH UNTIL YOU GET THAT 500,000 BACK IF YOU GET IT BACK. SO OUR INTEREST IS NOT ONLY A FUNCTION OF THE MARKET AND THE PERFORMANCE, BUT ALSO A WHERE THE MONEY IS AT ANY TIME BASED ON INFLOWS AND OUTFLOWS OF MONEY. SURE. THAT ONE. OKAY. WELL JUST SO YOU'RE SAYING THAT INTEREST FLUCTUATION I HAVE TWO FACTORS. MOVING ON. I CAN JUST WATCH CNBC EVERY DAY AND SEE WHERE THE MONEY'S GOING. I HAVE TO ALSO BE LIKE, OH, WE JUST PAID OUT $2 MILLION FOR, YOU KNOW, IF WE UNDERGROUND UTILITIES IN A BIG, YOU KNOW, PANEL WALKS IN WITH A BIG INVOICE FOR THE UNDERGROUND UTILITIES, WELL, THAT MONEY IS OUT THE DOOR FOR HOWEVER MANY NUMBER OF DAYS. AND THAT REDUCES OUR AVAILABLE INTEREST EARNINGS ON THAT PRINCIPAL. SO THIS ISN'T JUST SOME HOARD OF MONEY LIKE A DRAGON THAT WE SIT ON FOR 30 YEARS. IT'S AN ACTIVE PORTFOLIO. IS IT SAFE TO SAY THAT IF FED FUNDS RATE WENT DOWN BY TWO THIRDS, THAT IT WOULD IT WOULD HAVE A IT WOULD HAVE A I WOULD EXPECT INVESTORS TO MOVE INTO THE STOCK MARKET AND MOVE OUT OF THE BOND MARKET. CAN YOU TELL US HOW MUCH WE'RE DOWN IN INTEREST THIS YEAR? I, I CUT THE INTEREST EARNINGS. SO AGAIN IN THE REQUESTED BUDGET, I HAD CUT IT 800,000. NOW I'VE ONLY CUT IT 350,000. SO WE'RE GOING TO POSSIBLY DO A LITTLE BETTER THAN WHAT I THOUGHT. BUT AGAIN THAT'S A REAL NEGOTIATION FOR ME. BUT THE PROBLEM IS WE DON'T. OR THE FACT IS WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF PROJECTS IN THE 26 BUDGET. SO I DON'T EXPECT TO BE CUTTING NEW FLOWS OF MONEY. THE CURRENT FLOWS OF MONEY FOR CRA PROJECTS, WATER, SEWER PROJECTS AND GENERAL FUND PROJECTS ARE KNOWN TO ME. AND SO THOSE CASH DRAWDOWN SCHEDULES ARE ALREADY FACTORED IN. THESE ARE COMPLICATED CALCULATIONS. 
          THEY'RE VERY COMPLICATED CALCULATIONS. YOU KNOW, I DO MY BEST TO KEEP UP. SO AND THEN FINALLY AND THIS IS ON THE EXPENSE SIDE. AND THIS IS SOMETHING THE FLORIDA LEAGUE OF CITIES FOUGHT VERY HARD FOR. AND I THINK IT HAD BEEN 15 YEARS. BUT THE STORMWATER REGS HAD JUST BEEN UPDATED. THEY ACTUALLY WILL NOT GO INTO EFFECT THE NEXT YEAR. AND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WAS FOUGHT VERY HARD BY DEVELOPERS BECAUSE IT'S CONSIDERABLY MORE EXPENSIVE TO DEAL WITH THESE PRECIPITATION EVENTS THAT WE'RE HAVING THAT ARE SO MUCH MORE DRAMATIC THAN WE'RE USED TO. AND SO WE CAN ANTICIPATE ON OUR SIDE. AND THIS GOES TO OUR MOST PRIMARY RESPONSIBILITY AS A LOCAL GOVERNMENT TO PROTECT THE HEALTH AND WELFARE OF OUR CITY AND MAKE SURE WE CAN TRAVEL ON OUR ROADS, AND THAT WE GET RID OF THIS WATER IN A TIMELY MANNER, AND THAT PEOPLE CAN GO TO AND USE BUSINESSES. SO WHAT THEY'RE SAYING IS THESE UPDATED STORMWATER REGS ARE GOING TO REQUIRE MORE COMPLEX DESIGN AND MAINTENANCE. MUNICIPALITIES WILL NEED TO ALLOCATE MORE SPACE FOR STORMWATER MANAGEMENT FEATURES, USE HIGHER PERFORMING TREATMENT TECHNOLOGIES, AND UNDERTAKE REGULAR ROUTINE MAINTENANCE AND EVENTUAL COMPONENT REPLACEMENTS. 
          READ STAFF THERE. THE SHIFT FROM TRADITIONAL METHODS TO TREATMENT TRAINED STRATEGIES, COMBINING 
          [02:05:07]
SEVERAL BEST MANAGEMENT PRACTICES WILL OFTEN REQUIRE HIGHER INVESTMENTS UPFRONT AND OVER THE LIFE CYCLE OF THE PROJECTS. DESIGN AND ENGINEERING COMPLIANCE. THE PERFORMANCE BASED APPROACH REQUIRES MUNICIPALITIES TO DEMONSTRATE, THROUGH MODELING AND CALCULATIONS. THAT'S A COST WE WON'T BE INCURRING THAT NEW AND EXISTING SYSTEMS MEET NUTRIENT REDUCTION BENCHMARKS, INCREASING ENGINEERING AND COMPLIANCE COSTS. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THOSE COSTS ARE GOING TO BE. I KNOW WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO INCUR THAT. AND SO I HATE SAYING WITH NOT KNOWING, OH, WE'RE JUST GOING TO REDUCE THE BUDGET AND NOT MEET OUR OBLIGATION TO KEEP OUR CITY AND ITS CITIZENS SAFE. SO I HAVE WE ARE GOING TO SEE OUR BUDGET. WE ARE GOING TO SEE REVENUE DECLINE. AND WE DO NOT NEED TO COMPOUND IT. I GIVE MR. MORTAL AND THE PREVIOUS COMMISSIONERS TREMENDOUS CREDIT FOR KEEPING IT AT A FIVE OVER 70% OF THE OF THE MUNICIPALITIES IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA OVER THE PAST FIVE YEARS HAVE RAISED THEIR MILLAGE, AND WE HAVE NOT. 
          AND THROUGH THE HARD WORK OF THE CITY MANAGER AND OUR BUDGET DIRECTOR THAT WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO ACCOMMODATE THE ALREADY DECLINING REVENUES WE'VE SEEN AND MEET THE CHALLENGES OF 
          [COMMENTS BY CITY COMMISSIONERS]
INCREASING COSTS. LET'S MOVE ON TO. COMMENTS BY COMMISSIONER CLARK. DID YOU HAVE A COMMENT? I SAID, NO, NO, WE HAVE COMMENTS BY CITY COMMISSIONERS. DO YOU WISH TO MAKE ANY? NO. OKAY. 
          COMMISSIONER REED ROTH DOESN'T PAY FOR ITSELF. OKAY. MR. VICE MAYOR. OKAY. MR. MARTEL, I HAVE 
          [APPROVAL OF AGENDA]
NO COMMENTS. OKAY? I NEED AN APPROVAL OF THE AGENDA. APPROVAL? WE HAVE A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER CLARK. SECOND, A SECOND BY THE VICE MAYOR. WHAT? IT SAYS I DON'T KNOW WHAT AGENDA THERE IS. I THINK WE ALREADY. OKAY. THAT'S CORRECT. WE MISSED IT. I DO HAVE ONE PUBLIC COMMENT. I'M GOING IN ORDER WHAT IT TELLS ME TO DO. ANY PUBLIC COMMENT? SEEING NONE. ALL IN FAVOR? NO, NO. THERE'S ONE. THE CLERK DOES HAVE A ON THE AGENDA. NO. WE'RE GOING TO GO TO PUBLIC COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC. OKAY. HELEN MCBRIDE, WE'RE ON PUBLIC COMMENT. YES. AND I AM THE 
          [COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC (Non-Agenda Related) (3 Minutes Max.)]
PUBLIC. HELEN MCBRIDE AND FLAMINGO. YOU KNOW, I, I, AS I TOLD YOU THE LAST TIME I'VE GONE TO FOR YEARS AT THESE BUDGET MEETINGS, AND I REMEMBER WAY BACK WHEN THE CITY WAS REALLY DAMNED. WE'RE VERY PROUD OF OUR CITY, THE CITIZENS. IT'S THE CLEANEST. AND OUR RECREATION EVERY ONE OF OUR PARKS. FLAGLER SHEPHERD MEMORIAL, THE BANDSTAND ON THE WEEKENDS. YOU SEE ALL THE PEOPLE COMING. THAT'S GREAT. THAT'S GREAT FOR THE ECONOMY AND THAT. BUT MY MAIN CONCERN IS THE WORKING CLASS PEOPLE, THE CHILDREN AND OUR SENIOR CITIZENS. NOW, YOU WANT TO CUT, CUT, CUT. WELL, YOU MAY MAKE GOOD MONEY, BUT THERE ARE OTHER PEOPLE WHO DEPEND ON THE ACTIVITIES THAT HAPPEN IN OUR CITY. NOW, I REMEMBER I MARCHED IN PARADES. THERE WAS NO THERE WERE THE POLICE DEPARTMENT, NO BANDS, OR THAT WAS JUST THAT. WE ALL GOT TOGETHER AND WE THE KIDS FROM I THINK IT WAS THE STEWART MIDDLE SCHOOL CARRIED THE, THE FLAGS AND THAT. BUT, YOU KNOW, I THINK MAYBE SOME PEOPLE ARE BEING PENNY WISE AND POUND FOOLISH, BUT WE HAVE DONE WONDERS WITH 5% AND IT'S BEEN QUITE A FEW YEARS NOW. WHY? YOU KNOW, I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY SOMEBODY OR SOME YOU COMMISSIONERS. I'LL THROW YOU ALL IN THE POT. WANT TO BRING IT DOWN? IT'S GREAT. AT FIVE WE'LL GET ALL THESE SERVICES, YOU KNOW, OUR GARBAGE, OUR TRASH PICKUP, THE LEAVES AND THAT. REALLY, I HOPE AND PRAY THAT YOU STOP AND THINK OF THE LITTLE PEOPLE, THE SENIORS. I KNOW, I'M. I'M OVER AT THE 10TH STREET REC CENTER. MY GOODNESS, THAT HOW THAT HAS IMPROVED FROM WHEN IT USED TO BE CALLED SOUL CENTE. BACK IN THE DAY, ACTIVITIES. 
          EVERY DAY THERE'S ACTIVITIES GOING ON THE BALL FIELD. I'M ENJOYING IT BECAUSE THERE'S SOCCER, THERE'S FOOTBALL, THERE'S LACROSSE. AND THE LITTLE GUYS PLAYING THEIR BASEBALL AND THERE'S FOOTBALL, BUT NOT TOO MUCH. BUT PLEASE THINK OF THE LITTLE PEOPLE. I MEAN, IT'S FINE. YOU'RE SITTING UP THERE. I'M THE COMMISSIONER THAT LIKE I TOLD YOU THE LAST TIME, WHEN A 
          [02:10:04]
COUPLE COMMISSIONERS WISH THERE WERE MORE PEOPLE HERE, I SAID, IF YOU TAKE AWAY OUR SERVICES AND WE START DETERIORATING AGAIN, YOU WILL SEE THE PUBLIC HERE. THANK YOU. I HAVE TRAVIS DECKER. GOSH, THIS IS THE SECOND TIME IN UP HERE IN LIKE TWO WEEKS. NOT GETTING ANY BETTER AT IT THOUGH. SO ANYWAYS, GOOD AFTERNOON COMMISSIONERS, CITY OFFICIALS AND MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC. I'M TRAVIS DEKKERS, THE LEGISLATIVE VICE PRESIDENT FOR STUART FIREFIGHTERS LOCAL 2411 UNION. IT'S OBVIOUS WHY I'M UP HERE SPEAKING TODAY, AND I'M SURE THE FIRST THOUGHT IS I'LL SPEAK ABOUT THE DOOM AND GLOOM OF FIRE RESCUE IN THE CITY AND WHY CUTTING THE MILLAGE WOULD BE BAD FOR US. WHILE THERE'S A LOT OF THE MAJORITY, WHILE THERE IS A LOT THAT THE MAJORITY OF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IT IS WE DO WITH THE FUNDING WE RECEIVE, I'M GOING TO TAKE A MOMENT TO TALK ABOUT NOT JUST US, BUT THE OVERALL SITUATION. AS WE HEARD WHEN WE CUT THE MILLAGE. IT'S ALSO GOING TO AFFECT PUBLIC SAFETY. WELL, WE'RE SAYING WE DON'T WANT TO DO THAT. SO WE HAVE TO TAKE FROM OTHER FUNDING SOURCES, WHICH IS GOING TO TAKE FROM OTHER SERVICES AND POSITIONS WITHIN THE CITY. SO WHEN WE SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GOING TO DO THAT JUST TO MAKE ENDS MEET WITH FIRE RESCUE, SURE. WE'RE GOING TO KEEP POSITIONS IN FIRE RESCUE. THAT'S GREAT. THAT'S AWESOME. WE LOVE THAT. WE DON'T LOVE THAT OTHER PEOPLE ARE LOSING THEIR JOBS IN ORDER TO MAKE SURE WE DO THAT. ON TOP OF THAT, WHEN WE HAVE THE FUNDING WE GET FOR OUR ANNUAL BUDGET, WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT OUR TRUCKS. THE EQUIPMENT WE USE RIGHT NOW. ONE OF OUR ENGINES IS OVER 30 YEARS OLD. AT STATION TWO, AND ITS TRANSMISSION STUTTERS. AND THE WATER, THE TANK THAT CARRIES THE WATER TO FIGHT FIRE LEAKS. AND THAT'S NO FAULT OF OUR ADMIN CHIEFS. 
          THERE'S NO FAULT OF ANYTHING THAT THEY'RE DOING. WE HAVE TRUCKS THAT ARE ON THE WAY, BUT THAT'S TO TALK ABOUT HOW FAR BEHIND WE ARE AS A DEPARTMENT. AND I KNOW IT'S NOT JUST US THAT IS EVERY DEPARTMENT IN THE CITY. SO TO SAY THAT CUTTING THE MILLAGE IS GOING TO SAVE US IS I DON'T KNOW. TO ME THAT SOUNDS CRAZY BECAUSE IT'S NOT GOING TO SAVE US. IT'S GOING TO PUT US FURTHER BACK FROM WHERE WE'VE GAINED. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. MARK BRECHBILL. MR. BRECHBILL, GOOD EVENING. MARK BRECHBILL, 406 NORTHEAST PHINNY DRIVE, STUART, FLORIDA, 34996. SO WHAT I WANTED TO MENTION, I MEAN, I THINK THAT THIS BUDGET KIND OF REFLECTS THE DIVERSITY OF STUART. WE HAVE SOME VERY, VERY WEALTHY PEOPLE AND WE HAVE SOME PEOPLE THAT AREN'T WEALTHY. THEY FALL BELOW THE POVERTY LINE IN MANY CASES. MANY OF THEM ARE OLDER, RETIRED. THEY DON'T HAVE THAT KIND OF INCOME COMING IN. THEY'RE LIVING OFF OF SOCIAL SECURITY. I THINK THAT WE ARE GOING TO SEE A REDUCTION IN REVENUES COMING UP, AND THAT'S AND WE NEED TO BE PREPARED FOR IT. BUT WHAT WE DO NOW, I THINK, SHOULD BE MORE OF A SHORT TERM FIX WITHOUT ANY LONG TERM COMMITMENTS. AND THEN LOOKING AT THE LONGER TERM, IF THIS DOES HAPPEN, MAKING THOSE LONG TERM CUTS. AND WHAT I'M GETTING AT IS IF WE MAKE CUTS TO THE MILLAGE RATE, AND I KNOW YOU GUYS HAVE ALL LOOKED AT THIS, IT'S GOING TO GIVE MONEY BACK TO THE WEALTHIEST PEOPLE IN TOWN BECAUSE THEY PAY THE LARGEST TAXES. SO WHAT WE'RE TALKING AND IN SOME CASES WE'VE GOT RITA, WHICH, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ARE ALREADY GETTING MONEY ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THAT. WHAT I THINK WE OUGHT TO LOOK AT DOING IS HELPING SUBSIDIZE MAYBE ONLY ONE YEAR. IT'S NO LONG TERM COMMITMENT, BUT SUBSIDIZE THINGS LIKE UTILITIES. OUR UTILITY BILLS ARE HIGH. AND THAT'S THAT'S A BIG STRAIN ON MOST FAMILIES. BUT UTILITIES AND FIRE YOU KNOW, AND POLICE THAT TYPE OF THING. WE CAN WE CAN SUBSIDIZE THOSE COSTS. WE HAVE THAT FEE FOR FIRE. NOW MAYBE WE CAN SUBSIDIZE THAT COST FOR THOSE PEOPLE AND NOT COMMIT TO THAT LONG TERM. WE'RE NOT SAYING WE'RE GOING TO DO THIS AND WE'RE GOING TO STAY HERE. THE PROBLEM WITH REDUCING THAT MILLAGE IS ONCE YOU GET THERE, YOU KNOW, YOU MAY NOT BE ABLE TO GET IT BACK UP. AND THEN AT THAT POINT YOU MAY NEED IT. THE FLIP SIDE OF IT IS WE MAY GO TOO LONG AND NOT CUT WHEN WE NEED TO. SO I WOULD JUST ASK THAT YOU LOOK AT THE POSSIBILITY OF KEEPING THE MILLAGE RATE THE SAME, AND TAKING THE SAVINGS THAT OCCUR OUT OF THAT, AND PUSH IT BACK THROUGH THE SYSTEM AS A REDUCTION IN FEES FOR UTILITIES AND OTHER THINGS. AND THAT WILL MEAN THAT THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT VOTERS IN THE CITY OF STUART THAT WILL GET A BENEFIT, BUT THEY HAVE BUSINESSES IN STUART, AND THEY HAVE AND THEY LIVE IN STUART AND THEY THEY MAY BE DON'T OWN A HOME, BUT THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE RENTING. SO THAT'S MY ONLY COMMENT. I WISH, YOU KNOW, JUST IF YOU COULD TAKE A LOOK AT THAT. THANK YOU. I HAVE NO FURTHER PUBLIC COMMENT. MAYOR. 
          NO FURTHER PUBLIC COMMENT. NO FURTHER. WELL, SEEING NO OTHER ITEMS FOR OUR CONSIDERATION, THIS BUDGET MEETING IS ADJOURNED. WE WILL RECONVENE AT 430. WE'RE NOT RECONVENE. WE 
          [02:15:05]
WILL
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.