[CALL TO ORDER ]
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EVERYBODY. I'M CALLING TO ORDER OUR MEETING OF THE LOCAL PLANNING AGENCY FOR MAY 14TH, 2026. WELCOME, EVERYBODY. WELCOME. SUSIE. THE CLERK. IF YOU WOULD CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE.
CHAIR. PETERSON, VICE CHAIR HERE, BOARD MEMBER OF. I'M SORRY. BOARD MEMBER. GROSSO HERE. BOARD MEMBER. PALMIERI HERE. BOARD MEMBER SCHERER AND BOARD MEMBER VOGEL HERE. THANK YOU. IF YOU WOULD ALL STAND AND RECITE THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE, PLEASE. PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS. ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE OF GOD. THANK YOU. NOW, IF I COULD GET
[APPROVAL OF AGENDA]
SOMEBODY TO DO A MOTION TO APPROVE THE AGENDA. I'LL MOVE TO APPROVE THE AGENDA. SECOND.THANK YOU. AND IS THERE ANY COMMENT ON THE MOTION? ALL IN FAVOR? SAY. SAY IT OUT LOUD.
OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AND. WE WILL GO ON TO REQUEST A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES,
[APPROVAL OF MINUTES ]
PLEASE. MOVE TO APPROVE THE MINUTES. SECOND. ALL RIGHT. SOUNDS GOOD. AND I DON'T THINK I NEED TO GET ALL IN FAVOR. OH, ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE. YES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ALL RIGHT, LET'S SEE. DO WE HAVE ANY COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC TODAY? I HAVE NONE, CHAIR. NONE.SEEING NONE, WE WILL MOVE ON TO COMMENTS BY BOARD MEMBERS. ARE THERE ANY COMMENTS BY THE BOARD MEMBERS TODAY? ALL RIGHT. HEARING NONE, WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE ACTION ITEMS. OH, LET'S
[2. BACKYARD CHICKENS IN CERTAIN RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS (RC): ORDINANCE No. 2552-2026; AN ORDINANCE OF THE CITY COMMISSION OF THE CITY OF STUART, FLORIDA AMENDING THE CITY’S LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE CHAPTER II – ZONING DISTRICTS USES ALLOWED, DENSITY, INTENSITY, SECTION 2.06.00. – SUPPLEMENTAL USE STANDARDS TO ADD A NEW SECTION 2.06.24. BACKYARD CHICKENS IN CERTAIN RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS AND TO AMEND THE CITY’S CODE OF ORDINANCES CHAPTER 8 – ANIMALS, ARTICLE I. IN GENERAL, SECTION 8.2. – LIVESTOCK PROHIBITED IN THE STUART’S CODE OF ORDINANCES, BY REMOVING CERTAIN PROVISIONS RELATED TO ALLOW BACKYARD CHICKENS IN CERTAIN RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS; PROVIDING FOR THE REPEAL OF PRIOR ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS; PROVIDING FOR CODIFICATION; PROVIDING FOR SEVERABILITY; PROVIDING FOR AN EFFECTIVE DATE; AND FOR OTHER PURPOSES. ]
SEE HERE. RESOLUTIONS. ARE YOU GOING TO BE READING THE RESOLUTION? I CAN DO THAT. I WOULD APPRECIATE THAT. THANK YOU. OKAY. THE TITLE IS BACKYARD CHICKENS. IN CERTAIN RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS AND ITS ORDINANCE NUMBER 2552-2026, AN ORDINANCE OF THE CITY COMMISSION OF THE CITY OF STUART, FLORIDA, AMENDING THE CITY'S LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE.CHAPTER TWO ZONING DISTRICTS USES ALLOWED DENSITY, INTENSITY, SECTION 2.06.00 SUPPLEMENTAL USE STANDARDS TO ADD A NEW SECTION 2.06.2 FOR BACKYARD CHICKENS IN CERTAIN RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS, AND TO AMEND THE CITY'S CODE OF ORDINANCES. CHAPTER EIGHT ANIMALS ARTICLE ONE IN GENERAL. SECTION 8.2 LIVESTOCK PROHIBITED IN IN THE STEWARTS CODE OF ORDINANCES BY REMOVING CERTAIN PROVISIONS RELATING RELATED TO ALLOW BACKYARD CHICKENS IN CERTAIN RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS, PROVIDING FOR THE REPEAL OF ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS, PROVIDING FOR CODIFICATION, PROVIDING FOR SEVERABILITY, PROVIDING FOR AN EFFECTIVE DATE AND FOR OTHER PURPOSES. THANK YOU, AND I. DO I HEAR THE PRESENTATION NOW OR DO I DO THE MOTION? YOU CAN ASK FOR THE DEVELOPMENT DIRECTOR TO GO AHEAD AND GIVE A PRESENTATION ON THE ORDINANCE. GIVE US A PRESENTATION. YES. THANK YOU. GOOD EVENING, BOARD MEMBERS AND AND CHAIR, FOR THE RECORD, MY NAME IS JODY KUGLER. I'M THE DEVELOPMENT DIRECTOR WITH THE CITY OF STEWART. THIS ITEM COMES FROM YOU BASED ON THIS, ON FEBRUARY 23RD, 2026, THE CITY COMMISSION DIRECTED STAFF TO PREPARE THE NECESSARY ORDINANCE TO ALLOW BACKYARD CHICKENS WITHIN CERTAIN RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS. THE CITY COMMISSION RECOGNIZES A GROWING TREND TOWARDS SUBSTANTIAL SUSTAINABLE LIVING PRACTICES, INCLUDING THE DESIRE TO INCORPORATE PRESSURE LOCALLY SOURCED PRODUCTS INTO LOCAL INTO DAILY DIETS. ADDITIONALLY, THERE IS AN INCREASING INTEREST IN PROVIDING RESIDENTS WITH OPPORTUNITIES TO ENGAGE IN SMALL SCALE BACKYARD FOOD PRODUCTION, ALLOWING A LIMITED NUMBER OF CHICKENS ON RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES SUPPORTS THESE OBJECTIVES BY ENABLING PROPERTY OWNERS TO PRODUCE EGGS FOR PERSONAL CONSUMPTION. THE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS WOULD ALLOW THE KEEPING OF UP TO FOUR CHICKENS AS AN ACCESSORY USE ON AN OCCUPIED, DETACHED, SINGLE FAMILY AND DUPLEX PROPERTIES WITHIN THE R1, A R1 R2 URBAN NEIGHBORHOOD, SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED ZONING DISTRICTS
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WITHIN THE EAST STEWART NEIGHBORHOOD, AND THIS WOULD BE SUBJECT TO THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS OUTLINED IN THE ATTACHED DRAFT ORDINANCE. THIS ORDINANCE WAS PRESENTED TO THE COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT BOARD LAST WEEK, AND THEY DID VOTE TO MOVE THE ITEM FORWARD WITH A COUPLE CONDITIONS, AND I CAN GO OVER THOSE ONCE. IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO GO THROUGH YOUR ORDINANCE. AND I'M JUST GOING TO QUICKLY RUN THROUGH THOSE, OR IF YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO WAIT AND JUST HEAR YOUR COMMENTS AND I CAN PROVIDE THOSE COMMENTS, I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR COMMENTS.OBVIOUSLY, I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANY COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC, BUT CAN I GET COMMENTS FROM THE BOARD MEMBERS? I WANTED TO ASK ABOUT THE NECESSITY OF GETTING A PERMIT VERSUS LIKE JUST HAVING IT BE ALLOWED. AND THEN IF YOU KNOW, THERE'S A CODE VIOLATION, LIKE SOMEBODY CALLS KIND OF A THING. SO WE DID MODEL OFF OF OTHER JURISDICTIONS. AND I KNOW THAT A LOT OF JURISDICTIONS DO REQUIRE A PERMIT JUST BECAUSE OF CLEANLINESS AND NUISANCE REQUIRING ABATEMENTS. WE DO WANT TO VERIFY ON A YEARLY BASIS TO MAKE SURE THAT THE CHICKEN COOPS ARE MAINTAINED AND ALSO BEING MAINTAINED IN THE YARD, AND THEN THEY'RE IN GOOD CONDITION. SO THE IDEA IS THE CITY WOULD LIKE INSPECT YEARLY WHOEVER HAS A PERMIT AND MAKE SURE THEY'RE DOING IT CORRECTLY. THAT THAT IS CORRECT. AND IT'S JUST THE CITY'S OPTION THOUGH NOT YEAH AT THE CITY'S OPTION. SO IF WE GET A COMPLAINT AND WE DON'T HAVE A PERMIT, THEN THEY WOULD BE REQUIRED TO GET A PERMIT. IT JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT THE CHICKENS ARE MAINTAINED AND THE, THE, THE PROPERTY IS MAINTAINED AND ALSO MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS THAT IT IS AN OCCUPIED UNIT OR IT'S NOT A VACANT LAND. OKAY. WELL, ARE WE GOING THROUGH ARE YOU GOING THROUGH THE WHOLE THING OR IT'S JUST UNDERSTOOD THAT WE READ IT AND THAT'S. YES, I CAN YOU'RE NOT GOING TO READ THROUGH THE WHOLE THING. SO THANK YOU. SO IN THERE, I JUST WANTED TO POINT OUT A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT YOU'RE ONLY ALLOWED UP TO FOUR HENS. THERE WILL BE NO ROOSTERS ALLOWED. SO AS WE KNOW ROOSTERS CAN BE NOISY. SO THAT WAS THAT'S PRETTY MUCH STANDARD WITH OTHER JURISDICTIONS AS WELL. AT THE COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT BOARD, THEY DID MAKE A SUGGESTION OR MADE A RECOMMENDATION TO APPROVE THE ORDINANCE, WITH A FEW CONDITIONS TO CONSIDER ON PAGE FOUR OF YOUR ORDINANCE. THEY HAVE CONSIDERED WHERE THE LOCATION REQUIREMENTS FOR THE CHICKEN COOPS AND ENCLOSURE, WHICH IS UNDER SECTION C. THEY MADE SOME RECOMMENDATIONS TO CONSIDER. INSTEAD OF A FENCE THAT YOU COULD HAVE A HEDGE, INSTEAD OF HAVING A FENCE. ALSO, THEY WERE MADE A RECOMMENDATION TO MAKE THE CHICKEN COOPS LARGER AT SEVEN FEET TALL FOR TALLER PEOPLE. AND THEN IF YOU WANT TO PUT A FENCE, THEY HAVE A MAXIMUM OF FIVE FEET. AND THAT WAS SOME OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT THE BOARD HAD MADE. I WAS JUST WONDERING, THE ENCLOSURES, IT SAYS, SHALL BE SO CONSTRUCTED AND MAINTAINED AS TO PREVENT RODENTS AND OTHER PESTS FROM BEING HARBORED UNDERNEATH, WITHIN OR WITHIN THE WALLS. BUT I AM A LITTLE CONCERNED ABOUT THEM BEING STRONG ENOUGH TO RESIST COYOTES, BECAUSE THEY'RE EVERYWHERE NOW AND THEY LOVE CHICKENS. DO YOU THINK THIS WILL BE STRONG ENOUGH TO GET THE PEOPLE TO KEEP THE CHICKEN COOPS AND, YOU KNOW, COYOTE RESISTANT? UNFORTUNATELY, I CANNOT ANSWER THAT. I MEAN, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT YOU ALWAYS HAVE TO BE AWARE OF WHEN YOU HAVE BACKYARD CHICKENS. I DO KNOW THERE'S SOME CASES WHERE THEY DIDN'T SUCCESSFULLY SURVIVE, BUT, YOU KNOW, THERE IS OTHER WAYS WHERE SOME OF THE COOPS, INSTEAD OF A, YOU CAN MAKE THOSE COOPS A LITTLE BIT STRONGER. YOU CAN GET THOSE CUBES THAT I KNOW YOU CAN ORDER THEM ONLINE WHERE THEY ARE COYOTE PROOF. I HAVE SEEN THEM BEFORE TOO, BUT I IT'S, IT'S REALLY GOING TO BE THE OWNER'S RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY MAINTAIN THEIR COOPS. OKAY. WHAT IS THE PERMIT PROCESS ON THE COOP ITSELF? IS IT TREATED LIKE A STRUCTURE? THEY HAVE TO DO FULL. THEY DON'T HAVE TO PULL A BUILDING PERMIT OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. NO, IT'S JUST GOING TO SHOW YOUR MOVABLE STRUCTURE. IS THAT.
YES. YEAH. IT WILL BE A MOVABLE STRUCTURE. IT WILL IT WILL JUST SHOW THAT YOU'LL SHOW THE ASPECTS OF THE COOP. TYPICALLY, YOU'LL PROBABLY PURCHASE THEM. IF YOU BUILD THEM, THEN YOU'RE JUST GOING TO SHOW THE HEIGHT, THE WIDTH AND THE MATERIAL THAT YOU'RE GOING TO USE. AND THEN JUST SHOW IT ON YOUR LAND AND WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO SET IT BACK. SO IT LOOKS SIMILAR TO A PREFAB SHED THEN. IS THERE ANY TIEDOWN REQUIREMENTS ON IT? SO IT'S NOT BLOWING INTO THE NEIGHBOR'S HOUSE DURING THE HURRICANE? WE DON'T HAVE THAT. BUT IF THAT'S SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO RECOMMEND, WE CAN CERTAINLY DO THAT. I LIKE A SHED YOU WOULD DO TO TIE DOWNS.
WE COULD CERTAINLY ADD THAT LANGUAGE. IT'S REALLY JUST YOU CAN PURCHASE THOSE AS HOME DEPOT, THE TIE DOWNS. YEAH. SO THAT'S MY ONE CONCERN. MY OTHER CONCERN IS THE, YOU KNOW, THE
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SETBACKS TO HAVE IT FIVE FEET OFF THE PROPERTY LINES, BUT THEN 25FT FROM ANY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE. I GUESS MY FIRST QUESTION IS, YOU KNOW, WHAT COUNTS AS RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE IN THAT ASPECT OF IT IS A, I ASSUME POOL DOESN'T QUALIFY AS THAT, BUT A WHAT A LIKE FREESTANDING SHED COUNT AS A RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE. SO I, I SEE WHERE YOU'RE COMING FROM. I THINK THAT IF YOU SAY THE PRINCIPAL, THE PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE THAT WILL DEFINE THAT, THAT WOULD BE THE HOUSE. SO. IT ACTUALLY DOES SAY THAT THEY SHALL BE, YOU KNOW, BUILT TO KEEP AWAY PREDATORS AND WEATHER. SO I THINK THAT MIGHT INCLUDE THE COYOTES. BUT SO YEAH, I DON'T KNOW. I GUESS ONE OF MY ISSUES WITH IT IS THE SETBACKS OF IT. IF FIVE FEET OFF YOUR PROPERTY LINE IS CAN MAKE IT A NUISANCE TO YOUR NEIGHBOR. IF IT WERE TO BE A FURTHER SETBACK OFF THE PROPERTY LINE, THEN YOU CAN POSSIBLY ELIMINATE THE DOUBLE SETBACK OF FIVE FOOT AND THEN 25 FOOT FROM A STRUCTURE. BECAUSE, FOR EXAMPLE, LET'S SAY I WENT TO THE TROUBLE OF PUTTING THIS IN AND THEN MY NEIGHBOR DIDN'T LIKE IT. SO THEN THEY JUST BUILT A STRUCTURE FIVE FEET OFF THEIR PROPERTY LINE. AND THEN NOW I CAN NO LONGER HAVE MY CHICKEN COOP. SO BUT IT DOES SAY 25FT AWAY FROM THEIR HOUSE. RIGHT? BUT I'M SAYING YOU COULD GO AHEAD ALL THE TROUBLE, PUT IT, PUT A, YOU KNOW, CHICKENS IN YOUR YARD AND THE NEIGHBOR GOES AND BUILD SOMETHING AND THEN NOW YOU NO LONGER CAN'T HAVE IT. SO I WOULD RECOMMEND JUST A LARGER SETBACK IN GENERAL AND KEEP IT SIMPLE WHERE IT'S NOT ONE PROPERTY LINE SETBACK AND ONE STRUCTURE SETBACK. I THINK THAT BRIDGE COULD BE CROSSED IF WE CAME TO IT OR SOMETHING, AND I WOULD IF IT WAS ME, I'D INCLUDE SWIMMING POOL IN THE SETBACK OR OUTDOOR COVERED STRUCTURE. YOUR CONCERN IS THAT IS WHAT I'VE I'VE EXPERIENCED IT. I'VE BEEN TO A CLIENT'S HOUSE IN THE CITY OF STUART, ACTUALLY, AND I WAS STANDING IN THE BACKYARD AND I WAS LIKE, WHAT IS THAT SMELL? AND THEY'RE LIKE, MY NEIGHBOR HAS NEIGHBOR HAS CHICKENS RIGHT ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE FENCE RIGHT THERE. THAT WAS AN EXAMPLE OF SOMEONE DID NOT TAKE CARE OF IT. AND I KNOW A LOT OF PEOPLE WILL, BUT UNFORTUNATELY, THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT WON'T. AND YOU THINK THAT LIKE FIVE FEET WILL MAKE IT NOT SMELL. IF IT'S 15 OR 20, THEN IT BECOMES THEIR NUISANCE, NOT THEIR NEIGHBOR'S NUISANCE. OKAY, SO THAT'S WHERE MY ATTITUDE IS. WELL, I PERSONALLY DON'T THINK WE'RE GOING TO BE OVERRUN WITH PEOPLE GETTING CHICKENS. PERSONALLY, I THINK THAT IN MY OPINION, IT'S THOSE PEOPLE THAT WANT TO GET THEM, YOU KNOW, WON'T BE THE WHOLE CITY, BUT YOU NEVER KNOW. EVENTUALLY. I MEAN, YOU'RE GOING TO GET THE I WAS SURPRISED THAT THERE'S LESS IN HERE. THERE'S LIKE, THERE'S LIKE A MAXIMUM SIZE FOR THE COOP. BUT SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS SOMEBODY WHO'S LIKE KEPT CHICKENS, LIKE THERE'S NO, THERE'S NO LIKE MINIMUM PER CHICKEN, YOU KNOW, THAT CAN GET REALLY GROSS WHEN PEOPLE START TO LIKE HAVE WAY TOO MANY CHICKENS AND IT SAYS A MAXIMUM OF FOUR CHICKENS. SO IF YOU HAVE LIKE A LITTLE TINY, I MEAN, SO YOU'RE SAYING THEY MIGHT BUILD A SMALLER COOP. SO I, MY NEIGHBOR IN GOLDEN GATE KEPT LIKE SIX, 5 OR 6 CHICKENS UNDER THEIR GRILL WITH THE PROPANE TANK TAKEN OUT. IT WAS HORRIBLE. AND IT WASN'T FOR EGGS, IT WAS FOR COCKFIGHTING AND HUMANE.RIGHT. AND SO I'M JUST SURPRISED THAT THERE'S NOT STUFF IN HERE ABOUT LIKE, IF WE'RE, IF YOU'RE GOING TO FORCE PEOPLE TO GO TO THE CITY AND GET A PERMIT, LIKE, SHOULDN'T THERE ALSO BE SOME KIND OF LIKE, AND HERE'S THE RIGHT WAY TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR CHICKEN. YOU KNOW, YOU'VE GOT TO CLEAN IT. YOU'VE GOT, I DON'T KNOW HOW CITIES DO THIS, BUT LIKE, IF WE'RE GOING TO HAVE PEOPLE GET A PERMIT, SHOULDN'T IT ALSO BE ABOUT LIKE, YOU KNOW, KEEPING IT CLEAN AND LIKE, IT SOUNDS LIKE THE CITY WILL GET INVOLVED IF THERE'S A COMPLAINT OF SOME SORT? OKAY. WELL, SO ALONG THOSE LINES, I, I HAD TWO MAIN CONCERNS WITH THE MECHANICS OF THIS. AND TO YOUR POINT ABOUT COYOTES AND FOXES, AND I LOOKED STATISTICALLY. IT HASN'T BEEN TOO MANY YEARS SINCE THERE WAS A BEAR SIGHTING RIGHT ON MONTEREY ROAD, WHICH IS FINE.
THE. THIS LANGUAGE ALLOWS FOR SECURING THE CHICKEN COOP FROM PREDATORS. THAT IS STILL NOT GOING TO STOP PREDATORS FROM COMING AROUND. AND THERE'S GOING TO BE AN IMPACT TO THE NEIGHBORS WHEN THEY USED TO WALK ROVER OR LET HIM OUT IN THE BACKYARD. AND NOW THERE'S A FOX THERE, OR A COYOTE OR RACCOONS. SNAKES LOVE CHICKEN EGGS. IT'S GOING TO ATTRACT THINGS. AND SO. TYPICALLY THE REASON FOR THE LIVESTOCK ORDINANCE ORIGINALLY IS BECAUSE THERE'S MORE DENSITY IN THE CITY. AND AND THEY DON'T WANT TO DEAL WITH THOSE THINGS. I'M
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A PROPONENT OF THE CHICKENS, BUT I'M ALSO I ALSO THINK THERE SHOULD BE LANGUAGE THAT CONSIDERS THE IMPACT AND THE COST TO THE CITY OF DEALING WITH THAT AS FAR AS ANIMAL CONTROL OR, YOU KNOW, CALLS FOR COYOTES, WHATEVER. BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO COME AROUND EVEN IF THEY DON'T GET THE CHICKENS, IT'S GOING TO ATTRACT ANIMALS LIKE THAT. AND I ADDRESS THAT PARTICULAR CONCERN. WELL, OKAY, I'M JUST GOING TO SAY I WHERE I LIVE RIGHT BEHIND ME IS A BIG PARCEL OF CITY LAND THAT'S VACANT. AND I HAVE COYOTES AND NO CHICKENS, BUT COYOTES IN MY YARD EVERY DAY THERE WITH THE ALL THE DEVELOPMENT THAT WE HAVE, THERE'S NOWHERE ELSE FOR THEM TO GO. THEY'RE WALKING UP AND DOWN THE STREETS. I MEAN, EVERY NEIGHBORHOOD I GO IN, I SEE COYOTES. I DON'T THINK THE CHICKENS ARE NECESSARILY. AND I'M NOT OPPOSED TO PUTTING THAT LANGUAGE IN. THIS IS SAYING THEY'RE OUT. I ANTICIPATE A PHONE CALL LIKE TO THE CITY. I, I WALK MY DOG HERE EVERY DAY AND HAVE NEVER SEEN A COYOTE BEFORE. AND NOW I'VE SEEN ONE THREE TIMES IN THE LAST MONTH. WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT? AND SO THERE'S, I'M, I'M TALKING ABOUT AN IMPACT TO THE CITY NOW HAS TO RESPOND TO THAT.AND THERE'S A COST TO THAT. AND SO I'M WONDERING IF RATHER THAN THIS BEING CALLED A PERMIT, IF IT SHOULD BE A LICENSE THAT IS RENEWED ANNUALLY, AND IF IN ONE AREA THE DENSITY OF CHICKENS HAPPENS TO BE HIGH, THE CITY THEN CAN SAY, WE'RE EITHER RAISING THE COST OF THE LICENSES TO DEAL WITH ALL OF THE ADDITIONAL TRAFFIC AND RESPONSE THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE, OR WE'RE NOT ISSUING ANY MORE LICENSES IN THIS SPOT, BECAUSE IT HAPPENS TO BE THAT FIVE PEOPLE ON THIS BLOCK HAVE CHICKENS, AND WE HAVE A HUGE ACTIVITY OF OTHER WILDLIFE THAT IS ATTRACTED TO THE CHICKENS. I'M JUST LOOKING AT WHAT WHAT OPTION DO WE GIVE THE CITY? IN OTHER WORDS, OKAY, YOU GET YOUR PERMIT, YOU PAY A ONE TIME FEE. IT'S OVER. THE REST OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD HAS TO ABSORB WHATEVER HAPPENS. SO IF IT'S A LICENSE THAT HAS TO BE RENEWED WITH A FEE ANNUALLY, THE CITY CAN ADJUST THAT COST TO DEAL WITH ANYTHING THAT MAY HAPPEN.
AND IF NOTHING HAPPENS, THE COST NEVER GETS ADJUSTED. BUT IF YOU KNOW, AT SOME POINT, IF THEY SAY ANIMAL CONTROL HAS HAD TO RESPOND TO THIS AND IT'S WE'RE SPENDING A LOT OF TIME AND MONEY DEALING WITH ALL THIS. YOU WANT TO HAVE CHICKENS. ALL RIGHT. WE GOT TO DEAL WITH WHAT THE CHICKENS ATTRACT IN THIS AREA, AND WE CAN DO THAT. NOW. WE'VE GOT SOME RESOURCES TO DO IT, BUT THE PEOPLE WITH THE CHICKENS SHOULD KICK IN A LITTLE BIT SO THAT THEY DEAL WITH THAT. THAT'S ONE CONCERN THAT I HAVE. THE OTHER ONE, TO YOUR POINT, I LOOKED ON I GOOGLED CHICKEN COOPS AND PENS. YOU CAN GET SOME BOUGIE CHICKEN COOPS. I MEAN, THESE THINGS ARE BEAUTIFUL AND, AND CONSTRUCTED AND PRE-CONSTRUCTED AND THEY'RE, THEY'RE REALLY COOL. BUT THE FIRST THING I THOUGHT ABOUT TO YOUR POINT IS WE GET A STORM AND THAT THING'S GOING TO BLOW INTO YOUR NEIGHBOR'S POOL. SO THERE'S NO LANGUAGE IN HERE ABOUT DOES ANY OF THIS DO ANY OF EXISTING CODE OR BUILDING PERMITS APPLY TO THE STRUCTURE TO ANCHOR IT, MAKE SURE IT'S ANCHORED DOWN. IF IT'S BIG ENOUGH, IT SHOULD BE ANCHORED TO A WIND CODE. SO THAT AGAIN, THE NEIGHBORS DON'T HAVE A CHICKEN COOP FLYING INTO THEIR YARD. WHEN WE GET STORM A, B, C THOSE WERE MY TWO THINGS. LOOKING AT THIS, I, I DON'T CAN I RESPOND? ABSOLUTELY. OKAY.
ONE IS ONE THING I WOULD SAY IS LIKE, YOU KNOW, THE CITY DOESN'T ISSUE PERMITS FOR LIKE A COMPOST, YOU KNOW, AND I FEEL LIKE YOU CAN HAVE A 4X4 COMPOST FULL OF ROTTING FOOD THAT ATTRACTS RATS AND SNAKES AND COYOTES AND RACCOONS. AND THE CITY HAS NOTHING TO SAY ABOUT IT, RIGHT? WE DON'T HAVE TO PAY ANY MONEY. LIKE, I DEFINITELY HAVE ONE OF THESE COMPOST THAT HAS RATS IN IT. AND, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK IT'S THE CITY'S LIKE JOB TO, TO MONITOR AND REGULATE THIS AT THE FOUR CHICK, FOUR HEN LEVEL, YOU KNOW, LIKE IT'S NOT A FARM. I DON'T THINK SO EITHER. BUT MY POINT IS, WHAT IF ON YOUR STREET, SIX OUT OF EIGHT HOUSES HAVE A FOUR CHICKEN LEVEL? AND NOW THERE'S OTHER THINGS COMING BECAUSE OF THAT. AND SO TO HAVE A DOG, YOU ABSOLUTELY. IN THE CITY YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO HAVE THE DOG LICENSED. YEAH. RIGHT. AND TO HAVE ANY OTHER KIND OF ANIMAL THAT YOU WOULD, YOU KNOW, OKAY, YOU'RE GOING TO USE THE CHICKENS FOR EGGS, BUT YOU'RE STILL, I FEEL LIKE A LICENSE THAT'S RENEWED ANNUALLY GIVES THE CITY THE OPTION TO ADJUST FOR IMPACT. I UNDERSTAND I HAVE SOME CONCERNS ABOUT THAT. ONE
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IS I DON'T, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE VERY BOUGIE CHICKEN COOPS OUT THERE. AND, AND THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO KEEP VERY BOUGIE, RARE. AMAZING CHICKENS THAT YEAH, PUT OUT CRAZY COLORED EGGS. AND LIKE, I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD CONSTRUCT THIS TO BE JUST FOR THEM. SO I WANT TO LIKE, I HAVE CONCERNS THAT PEOPLE HAVE TO GET A PERMIT AT ALL FROM THE CITY. LIKE IT'S FOR HENS, YOU KNOW, LIKE I FEEL LIKE IT'S A PRIVATE PROPERTY THING. I DON'T THINK IT'S OUR JOB. I'M NOT GOING TO LIKE STOP ANYTHING OR VOTE AGAINST IT. IF EVERYBODY ELSE AGREES THAT LIKE, YES, WE HAVE TO PERMIT THESE THINGS. SO IN THE EVENT, I ALSO THINK IT'S LIKE NOT REAL THAT THERE'S THE PERSONAL OPINION. I'D BE INTERESTED IN THE DATA, BUT LIKE, I DON'T THINK IT'S REAL THAT FOR FOUR HENS, YOU KNOW, ACROSS SIX RESIDENCES IN A NEIGHBORHOOD IS GOING TO ATTRACT MORE COYOTES. AND IT'S NOT ONLY COYOTES. I HAVE THE RACCOONS. MY BACKYARD IS HAS SNAKES, WHICH I LOVE. I LOVE THE SNAKES. I DON'T MIND THE RACCOONS. I HAVE. I THINK WHEN I HAVE TWO DOGS, I HAVE TWO DOGS. IT'S BECAUSE IT COULD BITE SOMEBODY AND MAKE THEM ILL.AND I DON'T KNOW THAT YOU DON'T PERMIT YOUR DOG. YOU LICENSE IT ANNUALLY TO MAKE SURE THE SHOTS ARE UP TO DATE AND EVERYTHING ELSE. AND THAT ALSO, I'VE GOT TO BELIEVE, GOES TOWARDS THE RESOURCES FOR ANIMAL CONTROL AND THAT SORT OF, YOU KNOW, IF SOMEONE HAS TO CALL THE CITY, IF THERE'S IF THERE'S NO IF NOBODY'S ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE IMPACT, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER IT'S NIL OR A LOT. AND IF, IF IT GENERATES CALLS TO THE CITY TO MANAGE THE SITUATION WHERE THERE'S NO ACCOUNT IN HERE FOR THAT, I'D BE INTERESTED TO KNOW THAT. BUT BUT I HAVE ONE QUESTION. DOESN'T THE COUNTY HANDLE ANIMAL CONTROL? THE CITY DOESN'T, DOES IT? WE'VE CONTRACTED WITH THE COUNTY SHERIFF. YEAH, THE COUNTY HAS THE COUNTY SHERIFF, BUT THERE'S STILL A COST. THERE'S A COST TO THAT. AND AND THERE'S AN IMPACT TO THE NEIGHBORS. SO IN ANSWERING PHONE CALLS THAT MIGHT HAPPEN OR YOU'VE ACTUALLY WHETHER IT MAY OR MAY NOT, IT'S IT SHOULD BE A PROVISION THAT IS ACCOUNTED FOR OR EVERYBODY'S GOING TO GO, WELL, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOTHING WE CAN DO. WE VOTED THIS IN AND THE REST OF YOU JUST HAVE TO DEAL WITH IT.
SO ARE YOU. AND BELIEVE ME, I'M A PROPONENT OF THE CHICKENS, BUT I'M JUST SAYING THERE'S THERE'S NO LANGUAGE IN HERE THAT THAT ALLOWS FOR THAT. AND IT COULD HAPPEN EVERYWHERE.
I'VE KNOWN THAT PEOPLE HAD RABBITS. IT ATTRACTED EVERY CREATURE, YOU KNOW, AND AND PEOPLE GOT ANNOYED. I CAN'T WALK MY DOG. THERE'S THIS, THERE'S THAT, I'M AFRAID. WELL, ARE YOU SUGGESTING LIKE A MINIMAL LICENSE FEE TO START THAT WOULD GO UP? ABSOLUTELY.
IF WE NEEDED IT TO. ABSOLUTELY. ON FEE RIGHT NOW, THERE'S NO FEE RIGHT NOW. THAT WAS MY GOING TO BE. MY OTHER QUESTION TO STAFF IS, IS IS THERE A BLANKET DOES THIS FALL UNDER A BLANKET? AND SO ON AN ANNUAL BASIS, WE DO A SCHEDULE OF ALL FEES AND SO FORTH. AND SO IT WOULD BE ADOPTED EVERY YEAR. AND IF IT WOULD, IF IT HAS TO GO UP, IT WOULD GO UP. RIGHT.
JODY, IS THAT THAT'S WHAT I'M IN FAVOR FOR OF THE CITY BEING ABLE TO SAY THIS IS BECOMING A THING. WE HAVE TO COVER THE COST. AND IF IT'S NOT A THING, IT STAYS WHERE IT IS. AND IS THAT SOMETHING? HAVE YOU SEEN OTHER CITIES THAT HAVE HAD THAT KIND OF LIKE IMPACT? AND SO THEN THERE'S LIKE A REGULAR LIKE A RESPONSE? WELL, AND IT ALSO GIVES THE CITY THE OPTION TO SAY IN THIS SPOT, WE'RE NOT GRANTING ANY MORE LICENSES RIGHT NOW, WHICH I THINK IS NOT THE CITY'S JOB. COULD COULD THE PERMIT BE USED THE SAME WAY AS A LICENSE, THOUGH? I MEAN, THEY WON'T GIVE ANY MORE WORK DONE. NOT NECESSARILY. THERE'S NO EXPIRATION OF THE PERMIT TAKEN AWAY. IF THERE'S MY THING IS, WE SHOULDN'T BE GOING INTO PEOPLE'S BACKYARDS UNLESS THEIR NEIGHBORS COMPLAIN. BUT THERE'S. WITH A PROVISION, THERE'S NO WITH A PERMIT, THERE'S NO PROVISION TO COVER COSTS LATER WITH A LICENSE THAT'S RENEWED ANNUALLY, IT GIVES THE CITY THE PROVISION TO COVER ANY IMPACT COSTS FROM CHICKENS BEING AROUND IN A NEIGHBORHOOD NOW OR NOT, SOMEBODY WHO WHO WOULD TAKE CARE OF THEIR HANDS VERY RESPONSIBLY. I WOULDN'T CONTRIBUTE, YOU KNOW, I WOULD DIG IN MY COOP SO THAT, YOU KNOW, COYOTES CAN'T GET IN. AND LIKE, I DON'T THINK I SHOULD HAVE TO COVER YOU COULD BE THE MOST RESPONSIBLE PERSON IN THE WORLD. BUT COYOTES, EVEN IF THEY CAN'T GET IN, THEY'RE COMING OVER SNIFFING AROUND. SO ARE LIKE EVERYWHERE AND SNAKES AND YEAH, COMING TO MY COMPOST, LIKE I SAID, YOU KNOW. OKAY, SO.
WELL, I HAVE A QUESTION. WHAT ARE WE CONSIDERING THE PERMIT FEE TO BE RIGHT NOW? DO WE HAVE A NUMBER RIGHT NOW WE HAVE A ZONING FEE, WHICH WOULD BE $65, 55, 65, FIVE FIVE. RIGHT.
66506565 OKAY. SO YOU WOULD BE MORE COMFORTABLE IF WE CALLED THAT A LICENSE, NOT A PERMIT. I WOULD, AND I'D LIKE TO SEE THAT FEE BE MAYBE THE FIRST TIME BECAUSE THERE'S AN INSPECTION, IT'S $55 AND THAT COVERS THE COST OF SOMEBODY OR WHATEVER IT IS. AND THAT COVERS THE COST OF CITY STAFF GOING OUT THERE AND DOING THE INSPECTION, WORKING WITH THE HOMEOWNER, DEALING WITH THAT. AND THEN AFTER THAT, THERE'S AN, LET'S SAY THERE'S AN ANNUAL LICENSE FEE OF $25.
[00:25:04]
WHAT'S THE WHAT IS IT TO HAVE A DOG? NOW, I HAVEN'T HAD A DOG IN THE LAST FEW YEARS. IT'S $10, RIGHT. OR SOMETHING. IT'S FIXED. OKAY. SO TEN, 20 BUCKS A YEAR, ANNUAL LICENSE FEE. AND THEN IT GIVES THE CITY THE PROVISION TO SAY, WE'RE HAVING A PROBLEM WITH THIS. WE'RE CONSTANTLY RUNNING PEOPLE OUT TO REINSPECT THESE, THE NEIGHBOR COMPLAINTS, EVERYTHING ELSE, YOU KNOW, WE, WE, WE NEED TO RAISE THAT FEE TO COVER THE COSTS OF ALL THAT TO $45 A LICENSE. I'M KIND OF THINKING LIKE CAITLIN SAYS, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE A HUGE ISSUE. BUT I ALSO WONDER IF, IF YOU CAN GUARANTEE THAT, DO WE HAVE TO LIKE, DO WE HAVE TO LIKE, IMAGINE A PROBLEM AND SOLVE IT IN THIS SITUATION? OR CAN WE LIKE, YOU KNOW, ADOPT THE RESOLUTION? AND IF THE CITY IS HAVING A HARD TIME WITH IT, YOU COME BACK AND REPROCESS THE CONCERN IS THAT SOMETHING WE CAN DO, LET'S SAY THAT IT THAT IT TURNS INTO A PROBLEM. CAN THE CITY MAKE NEW RULES FOR BECOMING REQUIRING LICENSING, REQUIRING DIFFERENT, DIFFERENT THINGS THAN WE HAVE IN THIS RIGHT NOW? WELL, SO TO BE HONEST WITH YOU, I DRAFTED THE ORDINANCE AND I DON'T KNOW MUCH ABOUT CHICKENS, SO I'M LEARNING A LOT FROM SOME OF THE COMMENTS YOU GUYS ARE MAKING AND YOU'RE BRINGING THINGS TO LIGHT THAT I DIDN'T THINK OF. SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE GOING THROUGH THIS PROCESS. AND THAT'S A GOOD POINT. WITH CATS AND DOGS, WE DO AN ANNUAL LICENSE. WHEN I REVIEWED ALL THE OTHER CITIES THAT WE, JODY AND I, WHAT DID WE PULL ABOUT? 6 OR 7 MUNICIPALITIES? YES, SIR. AND WE LOOKED AT WHAT THEY HAD AND WE DIDN'T COPY ONE PARTICULAR ONE. WE TOOK BITS AND PIECES THAT WE THOUGHT WOULD BE RELEVANT, BUT THAT'S NOT A BAD IDEA. BUT I THINK RIGHT NOW IT IS A PERMIT. IT'S A ONE TIME CHARGE. AND THERE ARE I THINK YOU MENTIONED THAT THERE ARE SOME PROVISIONS. IF THEY VIOLATE THE YOU KNOW, THE PERMIT WILL BE TAKEN AWAY. I DIDN'T THINK OF AN ANNUAL THING, BUT IS THAT SOMETHING WE COULD IMPLEMENT IN THE FUTURE? YEAH. I MEAN, WE YOU DO AN AMENDMENT TO THE ORDINANCE. OKAY. AND TECHNICALLY WE'RE AMENDING THE ORDINANCE BY ADDING THIS. AND I DON'T KNOW THAT I MADE IT CLEAR INITIALLY, BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE DRAFT, ANYTHING UNDERLINE IS ADDING AND IF IT'S CROSSED OUT, WHICH NOTHING'S CROSSED OUT, THAT WOULD BE WELL IN THE IF YOU GO TO THE VERY END IN THE ORDINANCE. NOPE, THERE'S NOTHING CROSSED OUT. SO EVERYTHING, ALL WE'RE DOING IS ADDING LANGUAGE TO THE TEXT OF THE ORDINANCES, RIGHT? WE'RE NOT DELETING ANYTHING. SO EVERYTHING HERE WOULD BE ADDING. BUT IN THE FUTURE, IF WE FELT THE NEED THAT WE NEEDED TO DO A RENEWAL ON AN ANNUAL BASIS, YEAH, THAT COULD BE AMENDED TO ADD SOMETHING. SO THIS COULD BE LIKE A PILOT PROGRAM, SEE HOW IT GOES. AND THEN IF NECESSARY, IF, IF ALL YOUR CONCERNS AND FEARS COME TRUE, WE COULD ALWAYS AMEND IT TO THEN MAKE IT AN ANNUAL LICENSE FEE. I THINK THAT'S TRUE. BUT I ALSO THINK IT'S OUR JOB TO BE REALISTIC ABOUT THE POSSIBILITIES OF THINGS TO HAPPEN. AND I THINK IT'S ARGUABLE THAT IF YOU HAVE CHICKEN FOOD OR CAT FOOD OR ANYTHING ELSE LEFT OUT ANYWHERE, AND CHICKENS AND EGGS IN A IN A SPOT, YOU'RE GOING TO ATTRACT WILDLIFE THAT MAY NOT AGREE WITH YOUR NEIGHBOR'S CAT OR DOG OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. AND WE'RE TO BLANKET APPROVE THIS WITH NO VISION OF THE IMPACT POSSIBLE IMPACT OF THAT. I, I DON'T THINK WE'RE DOING OUR JOB. ALL CHICKEN FEED SHALL BE KEPT IN A SECURED COVERED. WELL, THEY CAN'T EAT IT IN THERE I THINK. SO YOU GOT TO PUT IT ON THE GROUND FOR THEM. WE COULD ALSO JUST SAY LIKE THERE COULD BE A PROBLEM. AND SO WE'RE NOT ALLOWING CHICKENS, RIGHT. BUT WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT LIKE HOW TO ALLOW CHICKENS 100%. AND I DON'T, I DON'T THINK, I THINK LIKE ADDING EXTRA REGULATION AND EXTRA LIKE INSPECTIONS AND EXTRA STAFF TIME IS NOT SAVING THE CITY MONEY. WELL, IT, IF YOU, IF, IF THE NEIGHBOR CALLS ONE TIME AND THE INSPECTOR HAS TO GO BACK OUT THERE, THAT'S ALREADY PROBABLY COST THE CITY 150 BUCKS. I THINK THAT'S EXACTLY HER POINT. EVEN IF YOU KNOW THE PERSON PAYS A LICENSE FEE, IT'S COSTING THE CITY MONEY TO REGULATE. YEAH, WHICH WE HAVE TO DO. BUT THERE'S NO WAY WITH A, WITH A, A ONE TIME PERMIT, THERE'S NO WAY FOR THE CITY TO ADJUST TO COVER THE COST WITH A LICENSE FEE. THEY CAN. WE JUST SAID THAT EVERY YEAR. SO THEY'RE GOING TO COME BACK HERE AND, AND OKAY, I'M SORRY, I THINK I GET WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. IT'S. I THINK JODY HAS SOMETHING TO SAY. IF YOU COULD TURN TO PAGE FIVE OF YOUR ORDINANCE, THERE IS SOME RAMIFICATIONS THAT IF A PERMIT NEEDS TO BE REVOKED OR IF THERE'S COSTS IN THE VIOLATION, IT DOES SAY THAT THE CITY CAN.RECOUP THE COST. IF THERE'S ANY ACTIONS TAKEN AGAINST THE HOMEOWNER, THERE IS PROVISIONS SET IN HERE THAT TALKS ABOUT THAT. OH, INTERESTING. SO D AND E DOES ADDRESS I DO THINK IT
[00:30:05]
ADDRESSES YOUR CONCERNS. AS FAR AS A COST IMPACT TO THE CITY. SO TYPICALLY IF IN TODAY, IF WE GET A IF WE GET A COMPLAINT ABOUT A CHICKEN COOP OR CHICKENS BEING ON THE PROPERTY AND WE'VE HAVE WE'VE HAD COMPLAINTS IN THE PAST. WE DO CODE, DO A CODE VIOLATION TO THE OWNER, THE. AT THAT TIME, THEY HAD TO REMOVE IT OR THEY GO TO THE MAGISTRATE. THERE'S FEES ATTACHED TO THAT. THERE'S TIME FRAMES AND THEN THEY. AND IF THEY DON'T COMPLY, THEN THERE'S LIENS PLACED ON PROPERTIES. HOPEFULLY BY THE TIME WE CAN GET THEM TO COMPLY.BUT THERE IS A RAMIFICATION. IT TALKS ABOUT CODE ACTION AND COST RECOUP. SO MY ORIGINAL POINT, I WASN'T EVEN TALKING ABOUT CODE VIOLATION. I WAS TALKING ABOUT ATTRACTING AND THE ANIMAL CONTROL IMPACT OF DEALING WITH THAT. THAT WAS MY FIRST THING. WHEN I THINK ABOUT CHICKENS OR, OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT IN. IT'S GOING TO ATTRACT IT'S BEEN MY EXPERIENCE MY WHOLE LIFE HERE. IT'S GOING TO ATTRACT OTHER THINGS. YEAH. AND, AND, AND THERE'S NO, THERE IS NO PROVISION TO ALLOW FOR THAT. THE COST OF THAT IMPACT FOR ANIMAL CONTROL RESOURCES OR HOWEVER THAT WORKS IN, IN HERE. I DON'T SEE HOW YOU CAN HAVE, EVEN IF IT'S FOUR HENS THAT CAN.
IF A CRITTER CAN SMELL THEM, THEY'RE COMING AROUND, EVEN IF IT'S SECURE AND THEY CAN'T GET IN. AND WHAT I'M WHAT I'M SAYING, WHAT I WAS ORIGINALLY SAYING WAS, NOW YOU LIVE NEXT DOOR, YOU'VE GOT YOUR LITTLE PUPPY THAT YOU LET OUT, YOU KNOW, AND NOW THERE'S, THERE NEVER WAS BEFORE, BUT NOW THERE'S COYOTES AND OR SOMETHING OUT THERE THAT'S GOING TO ATTACK YOUR ROVER OR, OR WHATEVER. AND I LOVE THE IDEA OF THE CHICKENS, BUT THAT'S KIND OF NOT FAIR TO WHOEVER HAS THE DOG. AND THEY'RE GOING TO CALL THE CITY TO DEAL WITH IT. AND, AND IF THAT I DON'T SEE HOW THAT CAN'T HAPPEN, IT'S GOING TO ESCALATE.
HUGE PROBLEM. MAYBE NOT. BUT I THINK THAT IT SHOULD BE A, A PROVISION FOR THE CITY TO BE ABLE TO COLLECT ANNUALLY OR NOT. IF IT'S NOT A PROBLEM, THEY NEVER CHANGE THE, THE, THE PRICE DOESN'T GO UP. BUT IF IT DOES, IF ENOUGH PEOPLE IN AN AREA HAVE CHICKENS, I DON'T SEE HOW YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE. DO YOU LIVE IN THE CITY? ABSOLUTELY. OKAY. CAN I HAVE MY WHOLE LIFE? NO, NO, YOU DON'T HAVE TO. I THINK YOU CAN JUST OWN PROPERTY, RIGHT? AND I MEAN, A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO IN THE A BLOCK FROM WHERE I GREW UP, THERE WAS A TURKEY WALKING DOWN 10TH STREET YESTERDAY. I COULDN'T BELIEVE IT. A WILD TURKEY CROSSED MY FRONT YARD.
AND SO YES, I HAVE A VIDEO OF IT. THE CREATURES ARE HERE. WE DON'T SEE THEM ALL THE TIME, BUT I'M CONVINCED THEY'RE HERE. I KNOW THERE'S FOXES AND COYOTES, LIKE YOU SAID, AND I JUST EVERY DAY CATS ARE GETTING MY DISAPPEARING. ONE OF THE GUYS THAT WORKS WITH ME HAD HIS CAT KILLED BY A COYOTE. AND IT WAS VIOLENT. IT'S GRUESOME. YEAH. I MEAN, I PERSONALLY, I'M LIKE A PROPONENT OF LIKE NOT LETTING YOUR CAT OUTSIDE BECAUSE I BELIEVE THEY KILL SONGBIRDS AND THEY'RE ENDANGERED AND, YOU KNOW, BUT I'M NOT I'M NOT COMING TO THE CITY TO BE LIKE, YOU HAVE TO GET A PERMIT FOR YOUR CAT, YOU KNOW? SO IT'S KIND OF LIKE WE LIVE IN A SOCIETY LIKE THE, YOU KNOW, YOUR DOGS ALSO SHOULD BE, YOU KNOW, IN A FENCE OR ON A LEASH. AND COYOTES ARE NOT AS SCARY AS YOU THINK. I MEAN, THEY DO KILL CATS BECAUSE CATS RUN AROUND AND, AND GET EATEN BY THEM. BUT IF A PERSON IS WATCHING THEIR DOG OR IT'S IN A FENCED YARD, IT SHOULD BE OKAY. I DON'T DISAGREE, I'M LOOKING AT IT AS IT'S A PHONE CALL TO THE CITY'S OFFICE. IT'S A RESPONSE THAT THE CITY HAS TO MAKE. THERE'S A COST TO THAT.
THERE'S NO WAY TO COVER THAT. AND I DON'T SEE HOW YOU CAN HAVE CHICKENS WITHOUT THERE BEING SOME MORE FOR THE CITY TO HAVE TO MANAGE. AND A ONE TIME PERMIT FEE OF 25, 65 BUCKS, I DON'T THINK IS GOING TO COVER IT. AND I THINK THERE SHOULD BE A PROVISION TO DO THAT. I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW YOUR OPINION ON THIS, BECAUSE WE HAVE SEEM TO HAVE LIKE SORT OF A I, I AGREE WITH YOUR COMMENTS THAT MOST PEOPLE ARE THAT ARE WANTING THIS ARE RESPONSIBLE, BUT THERE'S ALSO THERE'S THE RESPONSIBLE DOG OWNER AND THEN THERE'S THE IRRESPONSIBLE DOG OWNER. THOSE ARE THE ONES I'M WORRIED ABOUT. THEY'RE THE ONES THAT LEAVE THEIR DOG CHAINED, LIKE IN THE BACKYARD ALL DAY LONG, ALL NIGHT BARKING. AND THAT'S GONNA AT LEAST IN THE SHORT TERM, I SEE THAT HAPPENING WITH THIS, THIS PEOPLE ARE GOING TO SEE THIS AND BE LIKE, OH, THAT'S COOL. LET ME GET SOME CHICKENS. ZERO EXPERIENCE. YEAH. YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT EASY. IT'S I'VE NEVER HAD ASKED A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT DO. IT'S ACTUALLY KIND OF EASY.
IT'S, THERE'S, YOU HAVE TO KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOING. YOU HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF IT. YOU HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF PEOPLE MIGHT DO IT WELL FOR A FEW WEEKS, A FEW MONTHS, AND THEN THEY GET BUSY.
AND THEN NOW THEY'RE NOT CLEANING UP THE MANURE. THEY'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, KEEPING THE FEED IN A PROPER CONTAINER. AND NOW YOU HAVE, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE SMELL CONCERNS IN THE SUMMER.
YOU HAVE, YOU KNOW, MORE RODENTS. WE ALREADY HAVE ENOUGH RODENT ISSUES, YOU KNOW, IN THE CITY OF STUART, I THINK ACCOUNTS FOR THAT. YES. BUT I'M JUST WONDERING WHAT WHAT HOW
[00:35:03]
WOULD YOU SOLVE THAT PROBLEM THAT YOU'RE BRINGING UP? I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN SOLVE EVERYTHING, BUT I, I MEAN, I DON'T I'M NOT 100% AGAINST THE CHICKENS, BUT I JUST SEE TOO MANY. DO YOU FEEL THE LICENSING FEE WOULD AMELIORATE THAT, THOUGH? THAT'S A CODE ENFORCEMENT PROBLEM, RIGHT? NO, NO, BUT I'M ASKING HIM IF IT MIGHT HELP. IT MIGHT HELP WEED OUT THE PERSON THAT JUST SHOWS UP TO TRACTOR SUPPLY AND IS LIKE, OH, I'M GOING TO HAVE CHICKENS TODAY. YOU KNOW, THAT MIGHT HELP WEED SOME OF THE IRRESPONSIBLE PEOPLE OUT. IF IT'S SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT MORE IN DEPTH, I'M ACTUALLY THINKING OF PEOPLE WHO, YOU KNOW, ARE DOING THIS FOR PROTEIN FOR THEIR FAMILY IN A FOOD SYSTEM THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THE FOOD IS GETTING VERY EXPENSIVE, PARTICULARLY LIKE PEOPLE IN OUR CITY WHO KEPT CHICKENS FROM THEIR, YOU KNOW, COUNTRY OF ORIGIN OR WHATEVER IT IS AND CREATING A STRUCTURE WHERE LIKE, YOU HAVE TO PAY ALL THIS MONEY JUST TO KEEP THEM. LIKE, I JUST DON'T LIKE THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S A VERY, LIKE, IT'S A PROPERTY RIGHTS THING TOO. I'M PICTURING EVERYBODY BEING 100% RESPONSIBLE. YEAH. AND THE CHICKEN COOPS ARE SECURE AND THE FEED IS SECURE AND EVERYTHING ELSE. YOU ARE STILL GOING TO ATTRACT WILDLIFE THAT YOUR NEIGHBORS MAY NOT WANT AROUND THAT. THAT'S THAT'S THE PART THAT IF EVERYBODY'S GOT THE BEST OF INTENTIONS, THAT'S THE PART THAT'S NOT BEING ACCOUNTED FOR. BUT I MEAN, MY NEIGHBORS DON'T PICK UP THEIR DOG POOP, YOU KNOW, AND I JUST KIND OF HAVE TO DEAL WITH THAT BECAUSE I LIVE IN A CITY. I DON'T LIVE IN MONTANA ON A, YOU KNOW, HUNDRED ACRE PROPERTY.LIKE YOU JUST KIND OF HAVE TO DEAL WITH PEOPLE. I MEAN, THERE'S THINGS YOU CAN DO. LIKE YOU SAID, PEOPLE CAN CALL THE CITY IF THEY'RE NOT TAKING CARE. YOU KNOW, DO WE DO YOU HAVE TO GET DO YOU HAVE TO GET, DO YOU HAVE TO DEAL WITH THE CITY TO KEEP A BEEHIVE ON YOUR PROPERTY HERE? I KNOW YOU HAVE TO DEAL WITH THE. YEAH, THERE'S THERE IS A STATE. I THINK THAT'S THE STATE. THERE IS A STATE STATUTE THAT EXEMPTS THEM FOR HONEY BEES. YEAH. AND THAT YOU CAN HAVE I DON'T KNOW IF THE CITY DID OR NOT. WE CANNOT. THE STATE STATUTE PROHIBITS YOU FROM EVEN LICENSE A HONEY BEE. OH, INTERESTING. SO AND AND COMPOST THE COMPOST PROGRAM WITH THE CITY. YOU ALL PARTNER WITH IFAS WITH THE UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA. DID ANYBODY TALK TO UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA ABOUT BACKYARD CHICKENS AND POLICY THAT'S WORKED IN OTHER PLACES OR SO? MY PREVIOUS POSITION AT THE AT SAINT LUCIE COUNTY, I DID WRITE THE CHICKEN ORDINANCE AND WE DID WE DID TALK WITH IFAS, AND THEY GAVE US SOME GOOD INFORMATION TO HAND OUT TO THE OWNERS. WHEN WE HANDED OUT THE WHEN WE DID THE PERMITTING, JUST SOME GUIDELINES. AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN DO AS FAR AS AS FAR AS THE EDUCATION COMPONENT OF IT, THAT WE COULD ACTUALLY GIVE THEM THAT INFORMATION. THEY DO HAVE PROGRAMS WHERE THEY DO HAVE BACKYARD CHICKENS CLASSES. CLASSES. YEAH. SO THEY TEACH YOU HOW TO MAINTAIN A CHICKEN COOP, HOW LONG YOU SHOULD LEAVE THE LIGHT ON BECAUSE CHICKENS, YOU DON'T LEAVE THE LIGHT ON ALL, ALL THE TIME BECAUSE THEY'LL KEEP PRODUCING EGGS. SO THEY DO TEACH YOU THAT. AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE HAD ALREADY IF THIS WAS GOING IF THIS MOVES FORWARD IN OUR DEPARTMENT, WE WILL HAVE A EDUCATION COMPONENT SO THEY CAN LINK IN TO IFAS AND THERE'S OTHER FOUR-H CLUBS THAT HELP THEM OUT AS WELL. OKAY, THAT I HAVE SOME RESOURCES THAT WE CAN PROVIDE. I KNOW THAT I TOOK THE COMPOSTING CLASS AND GOT MY COMPOSTER FROM THE CITY, AND I THINK IT'D BE REALLY COOL IF WE GOT IF YOU COULD TAKE A CHICKEN COURSE WITH IFAS AND THEN GET LIKE A COUPON TO GO TO TRACTOR SUPPLY AND GET A COOP FOR HALF OFF, MAYBE THEY'LL HELP OR SOMETHING. BUT AND SOME OF THE FOUR CLUBS OFFER A PILOT PROGRAM THAT ACTUALLY THE THE KIDS CAN GAIN THEIR CREDITS. YEAH. BY ASSISTING NEW, NEW FAMILIES AND HOW TO MAINTAIN THEIR CHICKEN COOPS AND HOW TO FEED THEM AND TAKE CARE OF THEM. YEAH. I MEAN, I TEACH GARDENING AT THE BOYS AND GIRLS CLUBS, AND I'M DEFINITELY THINKING ABOUT LIKE PROGRAMING AROUND THIS FOR SURE. YEAH. SO FROM WHAT I CAN TELL, YOU'RE OPPOSED TO THE LICENSE. I'M OKAY WITH THE LICENSE. IT'S FINE. OKAY. SO IF EVERYBODY ELSE, IF, IF WE WERE TO ADD A PROVISION THAT THEY GET THAT THEY RENEW A LICENSE EVERY YEAR, WOULD YOU BE COMFORTABLE? I WOULD. AND MY OTHER CONCERN WAS, LIKE LANCE SAID ABOUT THE STRUCTURE, IT IT. THERE'S NO LANGUAGE IN HERE ABOUT. IF YOU BUILD A BIG ENOUGH STRUCTURE, THERE'S NO LANGUAGE ABOUT IT BEING SUBJECT TO THE EXISTING CODES FOR BEING ANCHORED DOWN OR WHATEVER, LIKE A SHED. BUT IT IS A CHICKEN COOP. THERE'S A, THERE'S A, IT'S GOT TO BE UNDER A CERTAIN. BUT IT'S ABOUT AIRBORNE, LIKE A TALKING ABOUT SOMETHING THAT COULD BE SEVEN FEET TALL AND IN A, IN A TEN BY 20. BUT PEOPLE HAVE LIKE DOGS, ENCLOSURES AND PLAYHOUSES IN THEIR BACKYARD. YEAH. I, I, I WOULD BE AMENABLE TO ASKING A LICENSING FEE EVERY YEAR TO RENEW IT. I THINK THAT'S WHAT I WOULD WANT TO SEE
[00:40:03]
ADDED. AND THAT'S ABOUT IT. OKAY. THAT'S WHAT, WHAT ARE YOU WHAT ARE THE STAFFING? YOU THINK THEY'RE RENEWING A LICENSE EVERY YEAR IS A GOOD IDEA. IS THAT HARD TO ADD INTO THE. NO. WE CAN CREATE THAT IN OUR OUR SYSTEM. YEAH. JUST LIKE OUR ANNUAL ALARM PERMITS, WE COULD DO THE ANNUAL LICENSING FOR BACKYARD CHICKENS. OUR ANNUAL WHAT? SORRY, ANNUAL ALARM PERMITS THAT WE ISSUE. SHE HAS AN ANNUAL ALARM PERMIT. SO WE COULD DO LIKE ANNUAL CHICKEN. OH I SEE, OKAY. WE ALREADY HAVE IT BUILT IN THE SYSTEM. YEAH, THE PAYMENT SYSTEM. SO. SO ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? ALL RIGHT. SO BASICALLY WE'RE LOOKING AT A MOTION THAT ACCEPTS THIS ORDINANCE ADDING AN ANNUAL LICENSING FEE. AND DO I HAVE A CAN I BEFORE WE VOTE. SURE. OF COURSE. WHAT IS THE WHAT WOULD WHAT WOULD THAT CHANGE IN THE PROCESS? SO IT WOULD BE RIGHT NOW AS WRITTEN, YOU GO TO THE CITY, YOU GET A PERMIT, AND THEN YOU NEVER GO TO THE CITY AGAIN. CORRECT. THE CITY. THE CITY HAS THE OPTION OF INSPECTING ON AN ANNUAL BASIS TO CHECK TO SEE. EVERYTHING IS UP TO CODE. IT'S OPTIONAL. I DOUBT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE ENOUGH STAFF TO DO IT EVERY YEAR. TO EVERY PERSON WHO HAS A CHICKEN, PROBABLY DO IT WHEN YOU GET A CALL, RIGHT? PROBABLY MORE REACTIVE THAN PROACTIVE, IT SEEMS. BUT IF WE GET COMPLAINTS THAT WOULD, YOU KNOW, ENACT IT WOULD CAUSE A REACTION FOR US TO GO OUT THERE AND INSPECT IT. AND IF THEY LOSE THE PERMIT, THEY WOULD HAVE TO REAPPLY FOR A PERMIT. NOW WITH A PERMIT, IF IT'S $65 AT THE FRONT, IT MIGHT NOT BE SOMETHING THAT'S RENEWED ON AN ANNUAL BASIS. BUT IF THERE'S A NEED TO INCREASE THAT COST, THE PERMIT CAN JUST BE INCREASED. AND THEN WHEN PEOPLE ARE ADDING OR GETTING CHICKEN COOPS, IT'LL BE AN INCREASED INITIAL COST OF PERMITTING. BUT WHETHER IT'S AN ANNUAL THING, I THINK ANNUALLY YOU CAN KEEP UP WITH IT AND MAYBE MAKE IT A LOWER. YEAH, I WOULD DEFINITELY THINK IT SHOULD BE LOWER THAN 60. HOW MUCH IS A DOG PERMIT, A DOG LICENSE? $10 IF THEY'RE FIXED.IF THEY'RE NOT, ISN'T IT 45. YEAH, I THINK IT'S 35 OR 5 OR 45, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. I, I WOULD BE IN FAVOR OF SAYING THE, THE FIRST TIME WHEN THEY HAVE TO DO THE INSPECTION, THE INITIAL LICENSE IS 65 OR WHATEVER. AND THEN AFTER THAT IT'S 10 OR 15 BUCKS A YEAR. BUT, BUT IT GIVES THE CITY A, A LITTLE BIT OF AN OPTION TO ADJUST THAT IF IT BECOMES A THING. AND IF IT DOESN'T BECOME A THING, IT'S 10 OR 15 BUCKS A YEAR. AND TO ADDRESS YOUR CONCERN, YOU KNOW, LIKE THAT WHEN SOMEBODY GOES TO GET A PERMIT, THE CITY'S NOT GOING TO WITHHOLD THE PERMIT UNTIL THEY GO INSPECT THE SITE EVERY TIME. THAT'S NOT HAPPENING. RIGHT? I MEAN, I THINK HIS CONCERN IS JUST THAT HE WANTS TO HAVE A LITTLE FINANCIAL BUFFER TO PAY FOR ANY COMPLAINTS OR IMPACT THAT IT MIGHT HAVE ON THE. I JUST I JUST DON'T BELIEVE THAT IMPACT EXISTS. BUT IT'S OKAY. I, I'M ACTUALLY WITH YOU, BUT I'M IN IN THE SPIRIT OF COMPROMISE.
OKAY. I THINK IT'S LIKE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE IN A POSITION HERE TO LIKE, LET PEOPLE DO WHAT THEY WANT ON THEIR PRIVATE PROPERTY WITH SOME OVERSIGHT, BUT WE DON'T HAVE TO LIKE, BE IN PEOPLE'S BACKYARDS EVERY YEAR, NOR WILL THERE BE AN INSPECTION EVERY YEAR. BUT I MEAN, BUT IF YOU HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE CITY AND PAY AGAIN AND LIKE, I GUESS IT'S GOOD TO GET MORE INFORMATION FROM THEM OR WHATEVER IT IS. BUT SO I DON'T FEEL THAT STRONGLY. I JUST, I JUST KIND OF THINK THAT'S NOT THE RIGHT WAY TO I, I, I PERSONALLY AGREE WITH YOU, BUT WE HAVE TWO OTHER BOARD MEMBERS WHO ARE KIND OF ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE FENCE. SO I FEEL LIKE THAT'S A GOOD COMPROMISE TO GET THE ORDINANCE PASSED. THE REVISION PASSED. SO ISN'T THE GOLF CART AN ANNUAL OR IS IT BI ANNUAL RAINFALL ON THAT? DOES ANYBODY I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO YEAH, I THAT'S BECAUSE I JUST GOT ONE. WELL THAT'S THAT'S ONCE A YEAR. IT'S ONCE ONCE A YEAR I BELIEVE. YEAH. IT'S A SIMPLE PROCESS. I DON'T KNOW, THAT'S NOT THROUGH MY DEPARTMENT. THAT'S ACTUALLY DONE THROUGH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT. YOU JUST GOT ONE.
JUST GIVE AN EXAMPLE. I DON'T KNOW, I CAN'T REMEMBER. SO WE'RE ASKING HOW MUCH IT COSTS TO TO GOLF CART RENEWAL EVERY YEAR. I'M JUST SAYING THAT THERE'S ALREADY A SYSTEM LIKE THAT. I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S EASY. I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S IMPORTANT FOR YOU GUYS TO IDENTIFY A DOLLAR. YOU KNOW, STAFF COULD FIGURE IT OUT. BUT I THINK IT'S THE PROCESS, WHETHER IT'S A INITIAL PERMIT OR AN ANNUAL RENEWAL, THAT THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING.
IT'S JUST LIKE ANY OTHER RENEWAL. YOU GO ONLINE AND YOU AND YOU DO IT. YEAH, I'M JUST, I'M JUST I HAVE A PROPERTY PERSON. I HAVE A QUESTION. MY PROPERTY LIKE, AND I UNDERSTAND THERE HAS TO BE OVERSIGHT. YEAH, BUT WE'RE IN THE CITY. THERE'S DENSITY, SO THERE'S NEIGHBORS AND WHAT HAPPENS A TIE, IT'S IT'S IT'S DEAD. THE MOTION WOULD DIE. SO. RIGHT. SO IF WE
[00:45:03]
NEED TO GET A MOTION TO TIE, THE MOTION DIES, BUT WE DON'T EVEN HAVE A MOTION YET. SO I ACTUALLY MOTION TO, TO RECOMMEND THAT THE CITY ADOPT THIS AS IS. OKAY. ANY SECONDS.GOSH. WELL, YOU KNOW, THAT'S GOING TO MAKE THE PROBABLY MAKE IT DIE. BUT IT'S ALL RIGHT. I DO NOT ANY SECONDS. ALL RIGHT. SO AT THE MOMENT THAT MOTION DOES NOT PASS. DO WE HAVE ANY MOTION TO APPROVE THIS ADDING AN ANNUAL LICENSING FEE. I MOTION FOR THAT. THE CHAIR.
CHAIR OH YOU CAN'T MAKE I CAN'T MAKE THE MOTION. BUT IF YOU WANT TO MAKE A MOTION, NO ONE ELSE MAKES A MOTION. YOU CAN PASS THE GAVEL TO SOMEONE ELSE AND THEY CAN BE THE CHAIR. OKAY, SO, WELL, I WOULD MOVE THAT THAT WE ACCEPT THIS WITH A LICENSE STIPULATION IN LIEU OF A PERMIT. AND THE LICENSE HAS A INITIAL FEE, THE SAME AS THE PERMIT FEE. BUT SUBSEQUENT TO THAT, IT'S IT'S $10 ANNUALLY AND RENEWS WITH THE OTHER CITY IN THE SAME WAY AS ANY OTHER CITY LICENSE FOR ANY OTHER THING, DOG, CAT, WHATEVER, ANY SECOND. I'LL SECOND IT. ALL RIGHT. NOW, THE MOTION HAS BEEN MADE TO ACCEPT THE ORDINANCE WITH THE REVISION THAT THERE BE A LICENSE. INITIAL COST OF 65 AND ADDITIONAL LICENSING FEE OF $10 EACH YEAR. WE'VE HAD A MOTION MADE. WE'VE HAD A SECOND ALL IN. AND I THINK WE NEED TO DO A ROLL CALL. RIGHT. OKAY.
WHAT WHAT DO YOU VOTE ON THAT? I'LL CALL THE ROLL. OH, SHE'LL DO IT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU.
BOARD MEMBER PALMIERI. YES. BOARD MEMBER. GROSSO. YES. BOARD MEMBER. VOGEL. NO. AND VICE CHAIR. YES. MOTION PASSES THREE ONE. ALL RIGHT. YOU OWE ME ONE. OKAY. NOW. HEY, I'D LIKE TO HAVE SOME CHICKENS. THE MOTION PASSES, AS YOU SAY. AND NOW WE ARE GOING TO ASK IF THERE'S ANY INFORMATION FROM THE STAFF FOR THE STAFF UPDATE. NOTHING FROM THE STAFF. AND I ANNOUNCE THE ADJOURNMENT OF THE MEETING.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.